Prof. Thanos Tzounopoulos Receives $2 Million Grant

[Sevv]

That sounds good. Bad side effects usually appear when you take a drug for a long time.

@attheedgeofscience also was among the few with permanent improvement from Trobalt, so it's certainly possible.

 

[Joly]

The clinical trials will be done within a year and a half. We are not ready to be saved.

 

[antonio77]

I have high hopes for this man.

 

[xyz]

Here is how I understood it.

• When are clinical trials expected to start?

Probably in 1 to 1.5 years if everything goes as expected and no showstopper (i.e. drug is toxic) in the preclinical trial occurs.

• Is RL-81 also supposed to help pain hyperacusis?

In theory yes, since the channel opener calms these hyperactive neurons down and this should also benefit hyperacusis. In the clinical trial they will also have hyperacusis patients.

• Since RL-81 is a reformulation of Trobalt, what is done to prevent that it does not have the same side effects?

This drug was designed to limit the side effects of Trobalt.


I think pain hyperacusis is just the nasty little brother of tinnitus and what might help against either of them might help also against the other. This drug sounds promising but I think we will first get a shot of FX-322 before we can test if the redesigned Trobalt solves our auditory problems.

 

[Nobody19]

I wonder what this means for other causes. Obviously treating underlying conditions is the first route to go down, but if that doesn't work (eg brains not adjusting accordingly anymore), how effective would it be?

Or, those with damage elsewhere in their ears? If it's targeting the brain's abnormal response to (any) damage within the auditory pathway, I hope it works for those without clear cochlear injuries too...

But time will tell. I do hope it'll be available and effective to those with chronic tinnitus too.

Research into tinnitus treatments is pretty much trial & error. We're not even certain what causes tinnitus. At least this drug is completely aimed at tinnitus, unlike most therapies whose main target is hearing loss.

• Is RL-81 also supposed to help pain hyperacusis?

In theory yes, since the channel opener calms these hyperactive neurons down and this should also benefit hyperacusis. In the clinical trial they will also have hyperacusis patients.

I think pain hyperacusis is just the nasty little brother of tinnitus and what might help against either of them might help also against the other. This drug sounds promising but I think we will first get a shot of FX-322 before we can test if the redesigned Trobalt solves our auditory problems.

I really hope so. Everyone who has experienced hyperacusis knows that it's a whole other demon compared to tinnitus - and I absolutely don't mean to downplay the effect tinnitus can have on someone.

 

[GlennS]

I wasn't able to watch the whole presentation. It seemed to be more intended for Thanos (nice name, heh) to establish his credibility.

Did they say how much they expect this drug to improve symptoms? Is it too early to tell?

 

[Nobody19]

I wasn't able to watch the whole presentation. It seemed to be more intended for Thanos (nice name, heh) to establish his credibility.

Did they say how much they expect this drug to improve symptoms? Is it too early to tell?

He is inevitable, or at least I hope he is

 

[serendipity1996]

Really curious to see whether this will be beneficial for noxacusis. Based on this it suggests that this kind of drug could be helpful:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4664349/

Also wondering whether potential treatments for pain hyperacusis, if they're targeting the type 2 nerve fibers in the cochlea would be local delivery or would a general pill be effective?

 

[FGG]

I wasn't able to watch the whole presentation. It seemed to be more intended for Thanos (nice name, heh) to establish his credibility.

Did they say how much they expect this drug to improve symptoms? Is it too early to tell?

It apparently works very well enough in rodents that they expect to move into clinical testing in humans in about a year and a half. His main concern seemed to be making sure it didn't have the side effects of Trobalt but they believe they can make it more selective and therefore both safer and more effective

 

[xyz]

Really curious to see whether this will be beneficial for noxacusis. Based on this it suggests that this kind of drug could be helpful:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4664349/

Also wondering whether potential treatments for pain hyperacusis, if they're targeting the type 2 nerve fibers in the cochlea would be local delivery or would a general pill be effective?

The last sentence of the conclusion in the book "Hyperacusis and Disorders of Sound Intolerance: Clinical and Research Perspectives" 2018 from Marc Fagelson and David Baguley says in the last sentence of the conclusion:

Moreover, if the induction of auditory pain in hyperacusis is at the periphery, then the side effects of retigabine (and those of any other new drug) could be minimised if delivered locally through systems for drug administration to the inner ear and we might thus see some progress toward clinical trials in the not too distant future.

 

[Joly]

The clinical trials are taking place in a year and a half. When can we imagine the drug coming out? He tries it on rodents who have had tinnitus for less than 6 months. Will the medication be reserved for acute tinnitus?

 

[Don Tinny]

Tinnitus is mentioned as a common side of Trobalt. But I assume that the drug works different in our "damaged" brain.

 

[Don Tinny]

The clinical trials are taking place in a year and a half. When can we imagine the drug coming out?

There is usually 3 phases for clinical testing. Maybe 6 years or more. Am I wrong?

 

[serendipity1996]

There is usually 3 phases for clinical testing. Maybe 6 years or more. Am I wrong?

Yeah I guess it also depends on whether they decide to apply for breakthrough status or fast-tracking.

 

[ASilverLight]

There is usually 3 phases for clinical testing. Maybe 6 years or more. Am I wrong?

I'd say 5-10 years, yeah. Which seems like a very long time, but if it's going to have similar benefits many reported having from Trobalt... I'd say it's worth it, no? Maybe that's just because I'm still young and would still have a lot of youth to enjoy in 10 years.

I have hopes this works for chronic cases too.

 

[Mentos]

I did try Trobalt for 2 months with no positive effect on my tinnitus. Luckily I experienced no side effects either. I wonder if RL-81 is to be more potent than Trobalt, if not then I think only a few lucky ones may benefit from it. I don't put much of my hopes in it.

 

[Don Tinny]

I'd say 5-10 years, yeah. Which seems like a very long time, but if it's going to have similar benefits many reported having from Trobalt... I'd say it's worth it, no? Maybe that's just because I'm still young and would still have a lot of youth to enjoy in 10 years.
I have hopes this works for chronic cases too.

Yes. It's a long time. Probably we will have FX-322 available sooner. But it's good to have two alternatives. If FX-322 does not work.. you have the pill.

I hope it works for chronic cases too. I'm trying to be optimistic.

 

[Nobody19]

Yes. It's a long time. Probably we will have FX-322 available sooner. But it's good to have two alternatives. If FX-322 does not work.. you have the pill.

I hope it works for chronic cases too. I'm trying to be optimistic.

Exactly, we can't put our eggs in one basket.

If FX-322 fails us, there are still other regeneration projects being developed like Hough's pill. If all regeneration meds fail to silence our tinnitus, maybe this will help us.

Going from phase 1 to a full release can easily take 10 years. We have to be patient. The safety tests exist for a reason.

 

[serendipity1996]

The last sentence of the conclusion in the book "Hyperacusis and Disorders of Sound Intolerance: Clinical and Research Perspectives" 2018 from Marc Fagelson and David Baguley says in the last sentence of the conclusion:

Moreover, if the induction of auditory pain in hyperacusis is at the periphery, then the side effects of retigabine (and those of any other new drug) could be minimised if delivered locally through systems for drug administration to the inner ear and we might thus see some progress toward clinical trials in the not too distant future.

This is encouraging to hear - Paul Fuchs from Johns Hopkins seems to think pain hyperacusis is more likely peripheral.

I've also seen Liberman discussing the possibility of developing drug therapies to selectively block the type 2 nerve fibers.

There are also other companies working on new and improved versions of retigabine, mainly for epilepsy, e.g. Xenon Pharma. Wonder if these could also be beneficial.

 

[Daniel Lion]

Exactly, we can't put our eggs in one basket.

If FX-322 fails us, there are still other regeneration projects being developed like Hough's pill. If all regeneration meds fail to silence our tinnitus, maybe this will help us.

Going from phase 1 to a full release can easily take 10 years. We have to be patient. The safety tests exist for a reason.

Its a dark comedy...
So yesterday I went to the doctor... she, he told me to come back in 13 years and charged me 200 dollars for the consultation.

 

[Lucifer]

This is encouraging to hear - Paul Fuchs from Johns Hopkins seems to think pain hyperacusis is more likely peripheral.

I've also seen Liberman discussing the possibility of developing drug therapies to selectively block the type 2 nerve fibers.

There are also other companies working on new and improved versions of retigabine, mainly for epilepsy, e.g. Xenon Pharma. Wonder if these could also be beneficial.

What phase is Xenon Pharma in at the moment?

With hyperacusis would we need to continue taking Retigabine everyday or would we only need to take it until it goes away?

 

[Don Tinny]

Its a dark comedy...
So yesterday I went to the doctor... she, he told me to come back in 13 years and charged me 200 dollars for the consultation.

Well...don't feel so sad. Most doctors don't know about these reasearch news.

 

[HootOwl]

Its a dark comedy...
So yesterday I went to the doctor... she, he told me to come back in 13 years and charged me 200 dollars for the consultation.

Hang in there Daniel. Well make it through these dark times together. There are definitely brighter days ahead (hug).

 

[xyz]

I did try Trobalt for 2 months with no positive effect on my tinnitus. Luckily I experienced no side effects either. I wonder if RL-81 is to be more potent than Trobalt, if not then I think only a few lucky ones may benefit from it. I don't put much of my hopes in it.

Maybe the dosage was not sufficient. Do you know others who have taken Trobalt for tinnitus?

 

[serendipity1996]

What phase is Xenon Pharma in at the moment?

With hyperacusis would we need to continue taking Retigabine everyday or would we only need to take it until it goes away?

They have several products in their pipeline - the one that's furthest along is about to start Phase 3 trials.

https://www.xenon-pharma.com/product-pipeline/

It might be worth contacting them and asking whether they're looking into tinnitus (and hyperacusis) especially as one of their treatments is indicated for 'orphan neurological conditions'

 

[Daniel Lion]

Hang in there Daniel. Well make it through these dark times together. There are definitely brighter days ahead (hug).

Thanks HootOwl.
I am hanging with you and my tinnitus family. We will make it to brighter days.
Thanks for the support... it feels good.

 

[Karl28]

Clinical trials in Australia. That's shocking. I wouldn't have expected they would do clinical trials there. I wonder why they would choose to do clinical trials there and not USA.

I'm in Australia. How can I get in on this ?

 

[Lucifer]

I'm in Australia. How can I get in on this ?

It won't be soon. They stated in a year or two they will start human clinical trials.

 

[Mentos]

Maybe the dosage was not sufficient. Do you know others who have taken Trobalt for tinnitus?

I can't recall the dosage. It was already like 3-4 years ago, but I followed Danny Boy's recommendation who was most experienced with it.

 

[dan]

I did try Trobalt for 2 months with no positive effect on my tinnitus. Luckily I experienced no side effects either. I wonder if RL-81 is to be more potent than Trobalt, if not then I think only a few lucky ones may benefit from it. I don't put much of my hopes in it.

I agree, Prof. Thanos is reformulating Trobalt to reduce toxicity, Trobalt did not cure tinnitus, not even close.

Does he actually think he found the magic molecule to cure or reduce tinnitus for every patient?