The Story of Gaby Olthuis

[Steve]

There are only few things in life which irritate me more than people who insist that the world should be viewed through rose tinted glasses. This is the kind of school textbook material that any hypocritical sissy doctor would pull out of their sleeve if confronted by a suicidal patient. As if they know better. Hypocrites...

I see death more as an ally than an enemy.

You are confusing me, do you think we shouldn't try and point somebody towards help? And do you think you know me to be able to make that sort of comment?

 

[Catarina]

I'm really, really surprised that so many of you seem to think that this shouldn't have been posted here at all. I come here for information, a chance to talk about my tinnitus with people who understand it and yes, support. If information that is uncomfortable were to be excluded, what would happen to the forum? Must we stop posting about what a bad day we are having, that our tinnitus is getting worse, that we have dark thoughts? Who is to decide what is OK to post and what is not. I hope this forum can continue to be open for any information related to tinnitus, good or bad. Perhaps we react so strongly to this particular story because it was officially sanctioned? Tinnitus sufferers suddenly become like pets who need to be put out of our misery. "They shoot horses, don't they." And that's offensive to us.

 

[attheedgeofscience]

I'm really, really surprised that so many of you seem to think that this shouldn't have been posted here at all. I come here for information, a chance to talk about my tinnitus with people who understand it and yes, support. If information that is uncomfortable were to be excluded, what would happen to the forum? Must we stop posting about what a bad day we are having, that our tinnitus is getting worse, that we have dark thoughts? Who is to decide what is OK to post and what is not. I hope this forum can continue to be open for any information related to tinnitus, good or bad. Perhaps we react so strongly to this particular story because it was officially sanctioned? Tinnitus sufferers suddenly become like pets who need to be put out of our misery. "They shoot horses, don't they." And that's offensive to us.

I agree. "Political correctness" and "censorship" are not friends-of-mine...

 

[attheedgeofscience]

You are confusing me, do you think we shouldn't try and point somebody towards help? And do you think you know me to be able to make that sort of comment?

I assume you are a well meaning individual. And you did what you had to do (as a hard working member of the board of this forum).

Sentences such as "there is always a better way" annoy me, however.

I really don't have much more to add to this thread.

 

[Steve]

I assume you are a well meaning individual. And you did what you had to do (as a hard working member of the board of this forum).

Sentences such as "there is always a better way" annoy me, however.

I really don't have much more to add to this thread.

And as somebody who has the financial means to do it, you have searched at length (and continue to do so) for the better way. Maybe you don't like the choice of words and maybe I sound like one of the shiny happy people. But the intention is to highlight support.

 

[Steve]

@Catarina I think you have raised a good point and it made me think. We have plenty of posts here about hard days and from people who are thinking very dark thoughts. They get support, people comment, generally try and make them see there are things worth living for and help to bring people through it.

This story on the other hand doesn't offer any support, nothing can change it. And the conversation around it is polarised in a way that it isn't remotely supportive.

You can't brush things under the rug and pretend they don't exist but what value has this particular thread given?

The story is sensationalised; it is a typical journalistic ploy to provoke strong responses to spread their story. Maybe if the post had instead been a summary of the struggle a lot of us had faced with reference to this lady taking the action she has, we would be having very different conversations now.

 

[Sameer advani]

Only success stories should be posted on the forum ...these success stories will help us be more positive ...sucide is a negative idea ,it makes the mind refocus on the t as a life threatning condition ...any ideas that helped reduce the t volume should be put up ...yesterday I recorded the sound of om with river sound in the background and played it for 8 hours and magically the holy vibration of the om sound reduced the t ...

 

[Sameer advani]

View attachment 1319
No matter what this story says there is always a better way. There is a whole world out there to experience, full of amazing, beautiful things.

If anybody thinks that they can't go on, talk to somebody:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_suicide_crisis_lines

(Above added by the staff of Tinnitus Talk, original post below)
View attachment 1321
Woman tells Nootdorp euthanasia story: "I have tinnitus and I want to die '
View attachment 1296

NOOTDORP - "I am a mother of two children, I have tinnitus and I want to die."Those words got NCRV reporter Miranda Grit in her mailbox from the 47-year-old Gaby Olthuis Nootdorp, with the question: "Do you want to do something?So many times I did not. "
"It was like really special," says Grit."You think, what's going on here?"She filmed Olthuis three weeks before she died, all of your specific needs by euthanasia.
In a major report Grit tells the story of a super intelligent woman who could no longer against the sounds in her head.Through this report Olthuis wanted to get recognition for her illness, says Grit."They wanted to show how it feels when you look healthy from the outside but inside is being tortured."

Lively woman
On the outside was nothing Olthuis' disease to notice.She looked like a lively woman and had a good job as a therapist.Yet they suffered for thirteen years from tinnitus, or ringing in the ears.
"People can not imagine what it's like to have that very disharmonious, very painful. Noise in your headIf nails are about the chalkboard or a train that inhibits, and 24 hours a day, "says the woman from Nootdorp in the report."I'm stuck in sound and it never ends," she explains.

In her head
"She could have easily thirty laps, so it's pretty special.It all happens in her head, 'says Grit.
During filming, she had to take into account any noise.My cameraman accidentally stumbled over a candle.It made such a loud noise that she totally cramped sitting on the couch. "The camera crew walked on tiptoe through the house to avoid having to make a sound."Only then will you realize that everyday life is full of noise and she could not stand."

"Learning to live '
Olthuis has been involved in dozens of experts but was always told that there was nothing to do.Tinnitus is not a deadly disease, "you have to live with it," she said.
The pain was so intense that Olthuis decided to no longer want to live."An inhuman act," she called it."I have two children, you can not die, leave your children.I also want to do so many things it's not that I do not want to live, "she told Grit.

Fight for euthanasia
Two years led Olthuis her fight for euthanasia.At first, the doctors did not want to cooperate, because she was not terminally ill."There are many forms of suffering also unlivable and that is really what I want to tell with this report," said Grit.
On February 1, Olthuis' wish was finally fulfilled.Her euthanasia was approved."I no longer have to suffer like this, to have so much pain and I need my car to drive. Against a treeDo not be.That gives peace. "Olthuis is deceased on March 1.

Broadcast
The program NCRV Always What Olthuis has filmed a few weeks before her death.The entire program is about Gaby Olthuis Tuesday to see the Netherlands 2. 20.45

http://www.omroepwest.nl/nieuws/15-...anasieverhaal-ik-heb-oorsuizen-en-ik-wil-dood

This should be posted on public sites and social networks so people can understand the pain of tinnitus sufferers ....it is not appropriate to be posted in a support forum where only tinnitus sufferers. Will be reading it and get more depressed ....I want to upload it on my face book page but can't figure how I can do that ... Can some one upload so I can share ...

 

[Stina]

This should be posted on public sites and social networks so people can understand the pain of tinnitus sufferers ....it is not appropriate to be posted in a support forum where only tinnitus sufferers. Will be reading it and get more depressed ....I want to upload it on my face book page but can't figure how I can do that ... Can some one upload so I can share ...

The story happened in Holland and all of the stories are in Dutch. You can share but nobody would understand. Her name was Gaby Olthuis if you wish to google.

 

[Saif]

R.I.P.
I saw her interview on youtube, it's really sad.
Can't blame her for what she did, I hope she's in heaven now.

 

[jchinnis]

Think about how different this might have played out here and how differently it would affect newbies if a journal article instead of a news item had been posted about the same subject. It is the sensationalism that makes it inappropriate where newly afflicted and frightened people come.

 

[jazz]

The story is sensationalised; it is a typical journalistic ploy to provoke strong responses to spread their story. Maybe if the post had instead been a summary of the struggle a lot of us had faced with reference to this lady taking the action she has, we would be having very different conversations now.

@Steve Very true. Stories like these are designed to evoke our emotions, not engage our minds.

Most importantly, what if you are terrified and anxious when you encounter this story? You've just gotten tinnitus and you feel trapped and alone. You've read that "tinnitus is forever" then you read about this woman's thirteen years of torture. What do you do? Do you say, "That's okay, I'll be fine." Or do you contemplate something drastic?

Obviously, this scenario does not fit everyone. In fact, it doesn't apply to most people. But some people are so frightened and feel so trapped that stories like these might be the final push. I especially fear for teenagers who possess strong emotions, but they lack the life experiences and resiliency to understand that a better way exists. To understand the power of healing.

This story is not a scientific journal article, nor is it an story of hope and survival. It's a sad tale that eschews hope and embraces death as the answer. What if someone seeking help finds this story and answers its call?

 

[Tenna]

I come here for information, a chance to talk about my tinnitus with people who understand it and yes, support. If information that is uncomfortable were to be excluded, what would happen to the forum? Must we stop posting about what a bad day we are having, that our tinnitus is getting worse, that we have dark thoughts? Who is to decide what is OK to post and what is not. I hope this forum can continue to be open for any information related to tinnitus, good or bad. Perhaps we react so strongly to this particular story because it was officially sanctioned? Tinnitus sufferers suddenly become like pets who need to be put out of our misery. "They shoot horses, don't they." And that's offensive to us.

The first time with t someone who posted a thread about a spike tilted my world, what would this thread do to a newb?
It isn't censorship when the rules are set exactly for the intend and purpose of what a support forum is. What would happen to the forum if we did not exclude information, that wasnt supposed to be here in the first place.. Op wasn't looking for support, he posted a piece of news. Spreading awareness is good, it just didnt fit into the category, countering the exclusion of a piece of news from a support section by turning it into censorship and political correctness? I don't understand.
Anyway, I assume there are many factors driving such a case to suicide, what surprised me is that this is considered news? Every disorder has some deaths I guess

 

[Stina]

The first time with t someone who posted a thread about a spike tilted my world, what would this thread do to a newb?
It isn't censorship when the rules are set exactly for the intend and purpose of what a support forum is. What would happen to the forum if we did not exclude information, that wasnt supposed to be here in the first place.. Op wasn't looking for support, he posted a piece of news. Spreading awareness is good, it just didnt fit into the category, countering the exclusion of a piece of news from a support section by turning it into censorship and political correctness? I don't understand

Actually the question was not only about where the thread is, but whether it should be here at all. You said in the first sentence yourself. Thinking of it as a piece of information or news might be fine for someone with a healthy psychology, however, if a person is naturally anxious and suicidal might not react so well, regardless of in which subforum it is.

 

[Denny]

Does this article really spread awareness or just reinforce the negativity about tinnitus?
How many times has anyone here told somebody they have tinnitus and heard
"oh my God that is terrible" . After a few of these kind of replies you probably stopped
telling people about it and continued suffering silently.

 

[meeruf]

I don't think there is always a better way. Everything comes down to one simple question: "Is it worth it?". If it's not. Why bother? Western world have a pretty fucked up view about death. It's almost against the law to die in this society. I know death is scary, but what is the problem? Either you go to heaven and everything is great (hopefully without tinnitus ), or nothing happens, and that is kind of chill too. You won't even notice you are dead if nothing happens. Nothing scary about that.

So, if all off your days are just plain misery. Tinnitus, pain, anxiety and other health issues. Yeah, I would probably put a needle in my arm too. Easy choice. Respect to this women!

I wish suicide was more accepted actually. So you could go out of this world with your family around you. With some dignity. Today you either have to jump of a bridge, or put a pullet in you head. (Unless you live in The Netherlands or Switzerland.)

 

[attheedgeofscience]

Anyway, I assume there are many factors driving such a case to suicide, what surprised me is that this is considered news?

It could probably be considered news because it is fairly rare for a non-terminally ill person to be allowed to die by euthanasia. And indeed it took her two years to get to that point.

 

[Lisa88]

Hope this story does get more attention in the world press. We are going to need all the attention we can get. My heart goes out to her and her family.

 

[Mark McDill]

Of course the site needs to be a place where people can freely talk about very difficult situations in a realistic manner (even thoughts/acts of suicide); however, a huge contextual difference exists between a member stating precisely what they are personally struggling with (expressing facts) and then receiving very focused personal support (targeted @ those facts) verses citing a dramatic news article/tabloid about 'the worst possible scenario'. The former engenders real support for an issue that can be reasonably taken at face value while the later simply adds drama, raises more questions than answers, and increases the anxiety of those that are likely in a very vulnerable/fragile emotional state.

It would be just like me approaching you stating there are man-eating sharks in the ocean (and citing a horrific instance) just as you are leaving for your first-time-ever trip to the ocean; however, if you were to approach me about your fears (of man-eating sharks) I could address that specifically/personally and perhaps offer some relevant advice geared toward you and your fear.

People on this site care about newbies and each other (I know I do); that is a large part of TT's center of gravity (that's what draws people). All the talk and debate about this article is ample evidence of that -- and, it is just one more reason I really like TT -- IT'S THE PEOPLE!

Thanx people

Mark

 

[Lisa88]

@Mark McDill, I always love your comments, and they have been so helpful to me. I know we think slightly differently on this one. And I say this with a bit of a smile on my face, ... if there were man eating sharks as I was going out for a swim, I would want to know about them

 

[stelar]

If you fear sharks, you will be wise not to go swimming in high risk shark waters off the coast of Australia.
But if they didn't report shark deaths, how would you know not to swim there and be eaten?

 

[Mark McDill]

@Lisa88 Thanx Lisa! That is a very nice thing to say and really encourages me -- once again; it's the people. I'm so glad to be a part of this site and an encouragement to others. T stinks and is annoying, but that doesn't mean we have to be like T

 

[Mark McDill]

@stelar Point well taken (good point); I was trying to highlight the context and method by which it is delivered -- I definitely am not, nor do I want to be, the censor-police (said tongue in cheek).

v/r

Mark

 

[Steve]

Just a question, this wasn't my idea but it seems more fitting:

Should this thread be called - The story of Gaby Olthuis?

To give her name feels more respectful of the story.

 

[cullenbohannon]

Sounds good to me Steve.

Just a question, this wasn't my idea but it seems more fitting:

Should this thread be called - The story of Gaby Olthuis?

To give her name feels more respectful of the story.

 

[Karen]

I agree, Steve. That way, if someone wants to read it, they can. And I like the idea of placing it under "Health Talk", if it must be posted at all. That is a much better choice than the "Support" category.

 

[jazz]

If you fear sharks, you will be wise not to go swimming in high risk shark waters off the coast of Australia.
But if they didn't report shark deaths, how would you know not to swim there and be eaten?

With this logic, maybe TT needs to post research articles about tinnitus-related suicides, not the occasional self-inflicted death one finds on the Internet.

The question is not "Should suicide ever be discussed?" but rather it is "Does this story about an individual's suffering that caused her to request euthanasia" belong on TT?

 

[Lisa88]

It may be helpful to see statistics on suicides for tinnitus, which seems to also be hidden on the www somehow. That way, that figure can be studied, monitored, and hopefully reduced as new physical and psychological treatments begin to emerge.

 

[jazz]

It may be helpful to see statistics on suicides for tinnitus, which seems to also be hidden on the www somehow. That way, that figure can be studied, monitored, and hopefully reduced as new physical and psychological treatments begin to emerge.

I will check some databases next week and see what's available. There are pay databases that aren't accessible to the general public.

 

[attheedgeofscience]

It may be helpful to see statistics on suicides for tinnitus, which seems to also be hidden on the www somehow. That way, that figure can be studied, monitored, and hopefully reduced as new physical and psychological treatments begin to emerge.

There is no difference in suicide rates between people with tinnitus and people without tinnitus. If statistics were kept on suicide rates for people with severe tinnitus, then there would probably be a slight difference. But not much. Human beings are surprisingly resilient.

In fact, doctors have a higher suicide rate than the average population. Most likely due to easier access to medicine, it is believed.

I do not see what value suicide statistics would bring to this forum, however.