2020 US Presidential Election

[Lane]

Trump Faces Mounting Defections From a Once-Loyal Group: Older White Voters

Clifford Wagner, an 80-year-old Republican in Tucson, Ariz., never cared for President Trump.​

He supported Jeb Bush in the 2016 presidential primary race and cast a protest vote in the general election for Gary Johnson, the Libertarian nominee. An Air Force veteran, Mr. Wagner described the Trump presidency as a mortifying experience: His friends in Europe and Japan tell him the United States has become "the laughingstock of the world."

This year, Mr. Wagner said he would register his opposition to Mr. Trump more emphatically than he did in 2016. He plans to vote for Joseph R. Biden Jr., the presumptive Democratic nominee, and hopes the election is a ruinous one for the Republican Party.

"I'm a Christian, and I do not believe in the hateful, racist, bigoted speech that the president uses," Mr. Wagner said, adding, "As much as I never thought I'd say this, I hope we get a Democratic president, a Democratic-controlled Senate and maintain a Democratic-controlled House..."
​

For Biden VP, Black Democrats are torn between Harris and Warren
The California senator represents the diversity and generational transition activists want, but polls suggest Black Democratic voters may prefer Warren.

WASHINGTON — Joe Biden is under pressure to pick a Black woman as his vice presidential running mate. But polls suggest the most popular prospect among Black Democrats is white.

Sen. Kamala Harris, D-Calif., and Sen. Elizabeth Warren, D-Mass., are widely seen by Democratic officials and activists close to the process as front-runners, though other candidates remain in the mix and a Biden aide told NBC News that "the process is dynamic and ongoing and no final decision has been made..."

In a CBS News poll last month, Warren topped the list of prospects that Democrats wanted Biden to consider, followed by Harris. Warren even led among Black Democrats — 72 percent said she should be considered, with 60 percent saying the same of Harris.
​

Panicking Trump tries to change the subject

The deadly pandemic is surging in the United States. Efforts to stop the spread have largely failed, with more Americans than ever becoming infected every day. In the face of the growing calamity, the leader of the country announced via Twitter he has taken decisive action -- to protect statues.​

 

[PeteJ]

Lane, your spam is amusing.

 

[Christiaan]

Trump Faces Mounting Defections From a Once-Loyal Group: Older White Voters

Clifford Wagner, an 80-year-old Republican in Tucson, Ariz., never cared for President Trump.​

He supported Jeb Bush in the 2016 presidential primary race and cast a protest vote in the general election for Gary Johnson, the Libertarian nominee. An Air Force veteran, Mr. Wagner described the Trump presidency as a mortifying experience: His friends in Europe and Japan tell him the United States has become "the laughingstock of the world."

This year, Mr. Wagner said he would register his opposition to Mr. Trump more emphatically than he did in 2016. He plans to vote for Joseph R. Biden Jr., the presumptive Democratic nominee, and hopes the election is a ruinous one for the Republican Party.

"I'm a Christian, and I do not believe in the hateful, racist, bigoted speech that the president uses," Mr. Wagner said, adding, "As much as I never thought I'd say this, I hope we get a Democratic president, a Democratic-controlled Senate and maintain a Democratic-controlled House..."
​

For Biden VP, Black Democrats are torn between Harris and Warren
The California senator represents the diversity and generational transition activists want, but polls suggest Black Democratic voters may prefer Warren.

WASHINGTON — Joe Biden is under pressure to pick a Black woman as his vice presidential running mate. But polls suggest the most popular prospect among Black Democrats is white.

Sen. Kamala Harris, D-Calif., and Sen. Elizabeth Warren, D-Mass., are widely seen by Democratic officials and activists close to the process as front-runners, though other candidates remain in the mix and a Biden aide told NBC News that "the process is dynamic and ongoing and no final decision has been made..."

In a CBS News poll last month, Warren topped the list of prospects that Democrats wanted Biden to consider, followed by Harris. Warren even led among Black Democrats — 72 percent said she should be considered, with 60 percent saying the same of Harris.
​

Panicking Trump tries to change the subject

The deadly pandemic is surging in the United States. Efforts to stop the spread have largely failed, with more Americans than ever becoming infected every day. In the face of the growing calamity, the leader of the country announced via Twitter he has taken decisive action -- to protect statues.​

You're seeing more stories about conservatives thinking about changing sides, not out of conviction of Joe Biden's clear cut policies or platform (not really his forte and really astonishing how he won the primaries despite of it), but foremostly because Trump has to be stopped before more damage is done. It might very well be the case that Biden could win the elections in a landslide in such an extreme way like Nixon vs. McGovern in '72. Seats for Congress and Senate would be also up for grabs for Dems in purple states. Hopefully that would put the current neoliberal, xenophobic version of the GOP out of business and replace it with something more reasonable (maybe the GOP from the Eisenhower era). Sorry to say this, but it's time people electorally consign that pseudo-populist, morally corrupt party to the dustbin of history.

 

[PeteJ]

You're a funny guy, Chris. Both sides are guilty. Both parties are the same... REMEMBER?????

https://thefederalist.com/2017/01/19/10-ways-obama-violated-constitution-presidency/

https://100percentfedup.com/obama-was-never-a-real-professor-of-constitutional-law/

https://fromthetrenchesworldreport.com/a-list-of-obamas-constitutional-violations/52988

https://thepoliticalinsider.com/icann-control-un/

 

[Christiaan]

@PeteJ. I'm not so sure about the similarities between the two parties from my outlook as a Dutchman (so I'm not entirely into the US politics game), except when it comes to pro-market reform in the 90's (Contract with America plans by the GOP and the rise of the third way economics by New Democrats like Pres. Bill Clinton and his ilk, who promoted things such as NAFTA). Now you're seeing that both parties are slowly turning to the flanks of the political spectre, and not towards the centre. The tea party movement has swayed a lot of republican voters and independents around 2009 to move the GOP further to the libertarian right in terms of economics, while maintaining a strong conservative outlook on social issues. And there's also a recent progressive wave that is slowly but surely pushing the Democratic Party to the left, making it a more plural movement of social democrats (or democratic socialists as Americans like to call it), social liberals and blue dog conservatives.

 

[Lane]

I heard a couple days ago in an interview with Steve Schmidt that an unusual number of prominent Republican operatives are actively working to defeat Trump. This USA Today article fits in with that information...

2020 Election: If Republicans care about America, they should vote for Joe Biden
Another four years of Donald Trump would be a disaster for America and the world. They would also be a disaster, and likely fatal, for the Republican Party.

"I spent years working to defeat Bill Clinton, Al Gore, John Kerry and Barack Obama. In those battles, I passionately believed Bob Dole, George W. Bush and Mitt Romney would make better presidents, but I never feared for the country if a Democrat won. That's how a civil society must function.

But today I do desperately fear for the country if Trump wins, again. History tells us that once hate is unleashed and legitimized by a major political party, it is difficult to stop. History will judge each of us on what we did to defend America in this tenuous moment.

America or Donald Trump? That's how this Republican sees the November choice. I say to my Republican friends: I know what side I'm on, do you?"

Stuart Stevens is a Republican consultant, writer and currently serves as a senior advisor to The Lincoln Project. His book, "It Was All A Lie: How The Republican Party Became Donald Trump," will be published in August. Follow him on Twitter: @stuartpstevens.​

 

[Carlos1]

I want Warren, but I think it's going to be Kamala, which doesn't bother me, as I think she would make a decent president.

@Zugzug You think Kamala would make a good president with her record on criminal justice?
That says it right there.

 

[Zugzug]

@Zugzug You think Kamala would make a good president with her record on criminal justice?
That says it right there.

Kamala goes where the winds blowing. The wind is blowing in the direction of legalizing marijuana and decriminalizing drug offenses. While her past record is concerning, I don't think it reflects the future. By the way, she is not my first choice by any means.

I'm not a big fan of purity tests. Governing is hard.

 

[Zugzug]

I think the internet has brought about a purity test bias. It is easier for young people to look everything up and dissect every decision. Most decisions are difficult and controversial. Literally everything disqualifies (in the mind of a young person) a Democratic candidate, or makes them a racist or a war criminal. Pump the brakes and look at the big picture. I keep hearing how stupid Republicans are, but they are at least smart enough to vote through things.

 

[Zugzug]

I can't stand Kyle Kulinsky. The guy is a know-it-all for absolutely no reason. Simply sucks at statistics and understanding polls. Gives strategic advice that is completely incorrect. Is the stereotypical coward that sits on the side lines and runs purity tests. Seriously, everything wrong with the progressive movement is related to Bernie bro factories. He even said, recently, he can't vote for Biden because he would have to "take responsibility for his mistakes." Then, he's the same guy that complains that Sanders is considered an outsider. Pick one. Come from the outside and be the victim and or get in the driver seat, shut up, and lead.

There are so many progressives I have respect for. David Pakman is my favorite political commentator, whether it be mainstream or not. AOC is becoming a strong leader, although I don't agree with her on everything. The purity tests can rot in hell. Our president just retweeted a "white power" video. What are we doing?

 

[Jcb]

Elmo for president

 

[Christiaan]

I can't stand Kyle Kulinsky. The guy is a know-it-all for absolutely no reason. Simply sucks at statistics and understanding polls. Gives strategic advice that is completely incorrect. Is the stereotypical coward that sits on the side lines and runs purity tests. Seriously, everything wrong with the progressive movement is related to Bernie bro factories. He even said, recently, he can't vote for Biden because he would have to "take responsibility for his mistakes." Then, he's the same guy that complains that Sanders is considered an outsider. Pick one. Come from the outside and be the victim and or get in the driver seat, shut up, and lead.

There are so many progressives I have respect for. David Pakman is my favorite political commentator, whether it be mainstream or not. AOC is becoming a strong leader, although I don't agree with her on everything. The purity tests can rot in hell. Our president just retweeted a "white power" video. What are we doing?

@Zugzug If we're talking about the role of pundits and in broader sense the media in the US, what is their stake in the current political climate in your opinion? Is the coverage on cable news (Fox News, MSNBC, CNN) fair? Aren't they a part of the problem that people vote against their interest, as is mentioned by certain politicians like Bernie Sanders?

 

[Zugzug]

@Zugzug If we're talking about the role of pundits and in broader sense the media in the US, what is their stake in the current political climate in your opinion? Is the coverage on cable news (Fox News, MSNBC, CNN) fair? Aren't they a part of the problem that people vote against their interest, as is mentioned by certain politicians like Bernie Sanders?

Fox news and MSNBC are right and left wing propaganda, respectively. Fox is worse, but still.

I don't hate CNN in the following sense. Pretty much every media outlet I've ever listened to has major flaws. Of course, their slant is not indicative of all of our problems and, at times, they emphasize the wrong things.

My biggest issue with them is not that they don't love Bernie or praise him. I believe people flock to Bernie because he's an outsider, which he should therefore own. My main issue is the way they influence the elections directly. For example, when Biden won South Carolina, there was all of this talk about momentum.

As a mathematician, you are supposed to view a sample homogeneously. In other words, someone in another state shouldn't be swayed because they saw the South Carolina result. I think that when Bernie took the lead early on, it was actually good that CNN didn't play this up. On this point, I don't think progressives have a huge leg to stand on since they were just upset that the momentum being talked about wasn't Bernie's. I often saw progressives wanting the media to talk about Bernie as the front runner. I disagree with this.

However, once Biden took the lead, they played up electability and the amount of momentum that Biden had. I didn't like this at all. Voters should get to decide for themselves.

The reason why this matters in this election is because the #1 goal is beating Trump. When polled, many people would rather make an ideological compromise for a candidate, if that candidate had the best chance of beating Trump. Therefore, this momentum talk is important, and influences elections.

I thought CNN was too big on the Russia scandal. Yes, cover it. It's real and not fake news. But it's not the problem of our times. CNN also sometimes enflames racial tension by only showing negative stories. I don't agree with all of Bernie's methods, but I do agree that there should be much more talk about poverty, failed economic policies, real statistics on healthcare, etc.

Honestly though, I find flaws in independent media. I think the key is just getting information from many sources.

 

[PeteJ]

@PeteJ. I'm not so sure about the similarities between the two parties from my outlook as a Dutchman (so I'm not entirely into the US politics game), except when it comes to pro-market reform in the 90's (Contract with America plans by the GOP and the rise of the third way economics by New Democrats like Pres. Bill Clinton and his ilk, who promoted things such as NAFTA). Now you're seeing that both parties are slowly turning to the flanks of the political spectre, and not towards the centre. The tea party movement has swayed a lot of republican voters and independents around 2009 to move the GOP further to the libertarian right in terms of economics, while maintaining a strong conservative outlook on social issues. And there's also a recent progressive wave that is slowly but surely pushing the Democratic Party to the left, making it a more plural movement of social democrats (or democratic socialists as Americans like to call it), social liberals and blue dog conservatives.

So, you admit you don't know what is going on - in the USA. I have some insight into the Netherlands although I was more thoroughly informed before I got tinnitus.

The Republicans and Democrats are both on board at removing rights 'to protect ppl cuz of coronavirus. ' Both support more government intervention, invasion of privacy and using more security (military) while conforming to the communist/marxist agenda gripping all of the West. I am not sure where you are getting your info but it's not accurate.

 

[Christiaan]

So, you admit you don't know what is going on - in the USA. I have some insight into the Netherlands although I was more thoroughly informed before I got tinnitus.

The Republicans and Democrats are both on board at removing rights 'to protect ppl cuz of coronavirus. ' Both support more government intervention, invasion of privacy and using more security (military) while conforming to the communist/marxist agenda gripping all of the West. I am not sure where you are getting your info but it's not accurate.

Oh really? A lot of people in my own country wouldn't even be bothered by how our Dutch political system works, let alone our political parties. Kudos to you then! What can there be said about our political system in your opinion?

What I was trying to say that you cannot know enough about a system as an outsider, but it can't hurt by looking at historical events in building your argument. The Contract with America was a formal blueprint of GOP in 1994 elections and onwards and written by Newt Gingrich with the intend to further limit the government's rol in economy in fiscal terms and in effect disciplined the GOP's congress and senate fractions in trying to achieve those goals. About NAFTA: while the plan took off during the Reagan administration, it was the Clinton administration that threw its full weight behind its implementation in 1994. This agreement also limits the rol of the government in terms of job protection (outsourcing work to lower wage countries) for blue collar workers. There's ton of internet sources where you can find this information.

 

[PeteJ]

Oh really? A lot of people in my own country wouldn't even be bothered by how our Dutch political system works, let alone our political parties. Kudos to you then! What can there be said about our political system in your opinion?

What I was trying to say that you cannot know enough about a system as an outsider, but it can't hurt by looking at historical events in building your argument. The Contract with America was a formal blueprint of GOP in 1994 elections and onwards and written by Newt Gingrich with the intend to further limit the government's rol in economy in fiscal terms and in effect disciplined the GOP's congress and senate fractions in trying to achieve those goals. About NAFTA: while the plan took off during the Reagan administration, it was the Clinton administration that threw its full weight behind its implementation in 1994. This agreement also limits the rol of the government in terms of job protection (outsourcing work to lower wage countries) for blue collar workers. There's ton of internet sources where you can find this information.

NAFTA was an absolute disaster especially for the USA. Many manufacturing businesses moved to Mexico and eventually, Asia. I don't know of any sane people who would defend that deal.

As for your country, other than it allowing some sort of limited euthanasia (or self-assisted suicide) the country has gone to sh*t. The EU has killed it. Your politicians have killed it. You have any number of radicals and terrorists living anywhere but definitely in the cities. Mass immigration and crime.

https://dutchreview.com/featured/criminal-migrants-in-the-netherlands/

But, I digress on our topic.

The liberals and leftists here are the biggest cowards and hypocrites.

There is violence and rioting from leftist protesters every day but they ignore it and when it's brought up, they evade that point and ignore it. Pretty pathetic if you ask me. I find the number of hypocrites and people like that to be about 80% of the population anywhere. It's scary.

 

[Christiaan]

Fox news and MSNBC are right and left wing propaganda, respectively. Fox is worse, but still.

I don't hate CNN in the following sense. Pretty much every media outlet I've ever listened to has major flaws. Of course, their slant is not indicative of all of our problems and, at times, they emphasize the wrong things.

My biggest issue with them is not that they don't love Bernie or praise him. I believe people flock to Bernie because he's an outsider, which he should therefore own. My main issue is the way they influence the elections directly. For example, when Biden won South Carolina, there was all of this talk about momentum.

As a mathematician, you are supposed to view a sample homogeneously. In other words, someone in another state shouldn't be swayed because they saw the South Carolina result. I think that when Bernie took the lead early on, it was actually good that CNN didn't play this up. On this point, I don't think progressives have a huge leg to stand on since they were just upset that the momentum being talked about wasn't Bernie's. I often saw progressives wanting the media to talk about Bernie as the front runner. I disagree with this.

However, once Biden took the lead, they played up electability and the amount of momentum that Biden had. I didn't like this at all. Voters should get to decide for themselves.

The reason why this matters in this election is because the #1 goal is beating Trump. When polled, many people would rather make an ideological compromise for a candidate, if that candidate had the best chance of beating Trump. Therefore, this momentum talk is important, and influences elections.

I thought CNN was too big on the Russia scandal. Yes, cover it. It's real and not fake news. But it's not the problem of our times. CNN also sometimes enflames racial tension by only showing negative stories. I don't agree with all of Bernie's methods, but I do agree that there should be much more talk about poverty, failed economic policies, real statistics on healthcare, etc.

Honestly though, I find flaws in independent media. I think the key is just getting information from many sources.

It's evidently true what you're saying that these outlets ought to be politically independent and should not pick sides in terms of who ought to be the most viable candidate for the presidency. Indeed, I thought the momentum talk was weird when pundits at outlets like CNN were talking about Biden's win in South Carolina as a march towards victory, given SC's high support in Afro-American society for him, which you can't generalise in other states. And still, a lot of people are buying this story of momentum.

I understand what you're saying about the saliency of electability & momentum as a way for voters to decide who the most viable candidate is vs. Trump. I think this hurts democracy because it doesn't say anything about someone's beliefs or platform. It's like they're making politics into a insubstantial popularity race based on things like image or their career (being former vice-president doesn't make you automatically a good president, Gerald Ford for instance when it comes to a pardon for president Nixon and economic stagnation). It's still up for debate what Joe Biden wants to achieve as a president, aside from maintaining the status quo of Medicare. It's the media's role to dive right into it.

Is it not that cable channels in America are too powerful? Are they also beholden to special interests? As in that they can set the agenda of what is deemed important and what not? Aren't people fed up with it and form a new channel to focus on underrepresented topics?

I don't know how it works in America, but in the Netherlands, if people think that some issues are not covered enough by traditional public broadcasting, they can create a new media channel if they can garner enough support and membership for a cable licence. Once it is created, they can finance their programs through general taxation by the government. This partly creates the effect that they are not entirely beholden to political parties or companies or other special interests to help determine how and what they should cover in the news, for instance.

 

[Christiaan]

NAFTA was an absolute disaster especially for the USA. Many manufacturing businesses moved to Mexico and eventually, Asia. I don't know of any sane people who would defend that deal.

As for your country, other than it allowing some sort of limited euthanasia (or self-assisted suicide) the country has gone to sh*t. The EU has killed it. Your politicians have killed it. You have any number of radicals and terrorists living anywhere but definitely in the cities. Mass immigration and crime.

https://dutchreview.com/featured/criminal-migrants-in-the-netherlands/

But, I digress on our topic.

The liberals and leftists here are the biggest cowards and hypocrites.

There is violence and rioting from leftist protesters every day but they ignore it and when it's brought up, they evade that point and ignore it. Pretty pathetic if you ask me. I find the number of hypocrites and people like that to be about 80% of the population anywhere. It's scary.

I think we hold different opinions concerning the alleged violence used by leftist protesters in USA, Canada or in The Netherlands, but I respect your views as you do mine.

I think there's a lot of exaggeration in certain media outlets about problems with migrants. That gives a skewed view about how things are. We don't really have that problem here, and I don't have any issues with migrants in the multicultural neighbourhood where I live. In fact, they are actually the biggest contributors in creating local jobs and are quite prolific in voluntary work in the community.

The main source of your article is De Telegraaf, a Dutch newspaper. It looks a lot like Breitbart or Fox News. They are not really known here for decent investigative journalism but rather publish articles on a whim without thorough research. It's the same newspaper that once reported that a neighbourhood in The Hague was under the rule of muslim radicals, and they called the place the ''Sharia triangle''. It turned out that there wasn't any such thing and the journalist made the whole story up to help sell the newspaper. And there's ton of examples like that about De Telegraaf. If you want to learn to find decent coverage about life in The Netherlands and want to learn some Dutch will you're at it, you can read (online) newspapers like De Volkskrant, NRC handelsblad and Trouw.

 

[Lane]

I heard a couple days ago in an interview with Steve Schmidt that an unusual number of prominent Republican operatives are actively working to defeat Trump.

Ex-George W. Bush officials launch new group supporting ...

(CNN)A group of former George W. Bush administration and campaign officials has launched a new super PAC to mobilize disaffected Republican voters for presumptive Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden.

The group, launched Wednesday under the name "43 Alumni for Biden," "seeks to unite and mobilize a community of historically Republican voters who are dismayed and disappointed by the damage done to our nation by Donald Trump's presidency," according to a release. The formation of the group is the latest example of efforts being made by anti-Trump Republicans to defeat the President in November.

Karen Kirksey, the director of the committee and who worked on the Bush 2000 election campaign and in the Labor and Agriculture Departments, said the endorsement of Biden is "not necessarily in full support of his political agenda but rather in full agreement with the urgent need to restore the soul of this nation."

"For four years, we have watched with grave concern as the party we loved has morphed into a cult of personality that little resembles the Party of Lincoln and Reagan," Kirksey said in a statement...​

 

[Carlos1]

@Lane
Being reported by the ever so impartial CNN.

 

[AtlasFainted]

Environmental issues are important to me so I have a question about the libertarian stance. @AtlasFainted?

I remember many years ago seeing an interview with Ron Paul where he says the libertarian stance is corporations should not be able to pollute outside their property but should not be restricted on how they use their private land.

Considering how water tables and air circulation works, this didn't seem like a viable solution to me.

Or, if he meant it literally, he would be suggesting 100% green technologies to comply (and how would this be enforced without government oversight?).

I know this tends not to be a "core" issue for conservatives but some groups align well with environmentalists (avid hunters are generally advocates for conservation, for instance). Any thoughts?

Hey, I just saw this! Didn't get a notification for some reason. I intended to come back around when @GlennS originally brought this up but never did. I'll do a write up when I'm back at my computer.

 

[Lane]

Being reported by the ever so impartial CNN.

@Carlos1 -- I'm a bit confused by your answer, are you saying the gist of the story isn't true? I've never heard of CNN fabricating whoppers such as that particular story. If you don't believe it's true, I'd be curious what you're basing that on. Maybe you do believe it' true, but you're trying to making a different point about CNN?

 

[PeteJ]

I think we hold different opinions concerning the alleged violence used by leftist protesters in USA, Canada or in The Netherlands, but I respect your views as you do mine.

I think there's a lot of exaggeration in certain media outlets about problems with migrants. That gives a skewed view about how things are. We don't really have that problem here, and I don't have any issues with migrants in the multicultural neighbourhood where I live. In fact, they are actually the biggest contributors in creating local jobs and are quite prolific in voluntary work in the community.

The main source of your article is De Telegraaf, a Dutch newspaper. It looks a lot like Breitbart or Fox News. They are not really known here for decent investigative journalism but rather publish articles on a whim without thorough research. It's the same newspaper that once reported that a neighbourhood in The Hague was under the rule of muslim radicals, and they called the place the ''Sharia triangle''. It turned out that there wasn't any such thing and the journalist made the whole story up to help sell the newspaper. And there's ton of examples like that about De Telegraaf. If you want to learn to find decent coverage about life in The Netherlands and want to learn some Dutch will you're at it, you can read (online) newspapers like De Volkskrant, NRC handelsblad and Trouw.

Whatever. I'm well informed on that topic. You're a liar.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-europe-migrants-netherlands-idUSKCN0RA0WY20150910

https://www.jihadwatch.org/2020/04/...ho-murdered-18-year-old-boy-is-muslim-migrant

You have the audacity to criticize that article and source when the MSM in Europe lie and sugarcoat the migrant situation - they have been exposed for lying, too. That article might have a bias but they cited people so if there's something wrong there, point it out.

The MSM has assisted in covering up migrant crimes and omit information. European governments also fund left wing organizations including in Sweden and Germany. Germany even subsidizes antifa in Europe.

https://europeansworldwide.wordpress.com/2020/06/25/antifa-is-a-section-of-german-government/

This is just a handful of examples but the Left has a monopoly on information people receive. It's biased and follows an agenda to brainwash the Dutch population in your case. You sound like you're indoctrinated already.

 

[PeteJ]

@Christiaan:

https://dw.com/en/dutch-minister-resigns-over-asylum-seeker-crime-report/a-48822640

https://www.britainfirst.org/another_immigrant_crime_cover_up_this_time_in_holland

Spare me the condescending 'hugs.' I don't want them. If you don't have a response or want to evade/ignore my post, do what FGG does and just don't reply at all.

This kind of thing happens all over western countries especially European ones. If anyone thinks these leftist/liberal parties in power are suddenly going to improve the health system or invest in something you care about, you are seriously deluding yourselves. You're not a priority.

 

[Tanni]

Whatever. I'm well informed on that topic. You're a liar.

Oof. @Christiaan has been calm and respectful, and you're majorly losing your sh*t. I know nothing about American/Dutch politics, but I know who looks better informed from where I'm sitting.

 

[FGG]

Came across this today:

https://www.militarytimes.com/news/...statues-citing-veterans-memorial-protections/

The confederacy lasted only 4 years and was literal treason (declaring war against the US). Not to mention that the statues were put up during the Jim Crow era and not after the war (and funded by groups affiliated with the KKK). A ten year sentence is *ridiculous* and just political posturing.

Compare that to damage of national parks:

"Under the Code of Federal Regulations, it is prohibited to destroy, injure, deface, or damage national park property. Vandalism of national parks is a federal misdemeanor, and is punishable by three to six months in prison and as much as a $500 fine."

 

[PeteJ]

Oof. @Christiaan has been calm and respectful, and you're majorly losing your sh*t. I know nothing about American/Dutch politics, but I know who looks better informed from where I'm sitting.

I don't care. You don't know the topic and so many people have been lying about it which I have no patience for.

 

[PeteJ]

No one replies to my points and the few that do have been obviously Republican supporters, maybe even favorable to Trump. They probably have passionate or strong views on the conservative side and I probably wouldn't concur with most of it but they did respond or reply to me directly. They also showed that they could with a thought out response that illustrated they understood what my points were.

Still waiting for the "democrats" to reply. It just bothers me to read their posts in the tinnitus section talking about research and the the need for attention and funding - and they support the worst possible politics.

Are you guys communists and marxists? Are they gonna help you? Go study the Russian Revolution. I did.

I think it's safe to assume you support liberal causes like BLM which I pointed out is funded by the Democrats. They're also a Marxist organization which I cited. Yet, only crickets here.

 

[PeteJ]

Oof. @Christiaan has been calm and respectful, and you're majorly losing your sh*t. I know nothing about American/Dutch politics, but I know who looks better informed from where I'm sitting.

Sorry. You just don't understand.

 

[FGG]

No one replies to my points and the few that do have been obviously Republican supporters, maybe even favorable to Trump. They probably have passionate or strong views on the conservative side and I probably wouldn't concur with most of it but they did respond or reply to me directly. They also showed that they could with a thought out response that illustrated they understood what my points were.

Still waiting for the "democrats" to reply. It just bothers me to read their posts in the tinnitus section talking about research and the the need for attention and funding - and they support the worst possible politics.

Are you guys communists and marxists? Are they gonna help you? Go study the Russian Revolution. I did.

I think it's safe to assume you support liberal causes like BLM which I pointed out is funded by the Democrats. They're also a Marxist organization which I cited. Yet, only crickets here.

Not for nothing, but @Christiaan did reply (very patiently and with a genuine interest in trying to understand your point of view) to you and you called him a liar for relaying his personal experience.

He refuted your points and your counter argument was that he's just a liar. Who in their right mind would want to engage in that kind of discourse?