Solsaem Clinic (Dr. Minbo Shim) Experience

[Jack Straw]

I don't know, I just think him and John have beef and it's only going to grow more and more because of these kind of antics. Ed brought Shim up, no one else brought him up. He did it all himself, by himself. Maybe they should go into the UFC and donate the money to funding for treating tinnitus.

Dana White might be on board. He has tinnitus too.

 

[GlennAz]

As someone else who also participated in this treatment can you please post your before and after audiograms? Preferably ones that happened before and after you went you South Korea.

I need to wait a couple more months before going to my Az audiologist again. I have the pre ones, and they are really bad. They start out at a 50-60 dB loss, and head south quickly from there. I'll post my new ones when I get them.

 

[Jack Straw]

I need to wait a couple more months before going to my Az audiologist again. I have the pre ones, and they are really bad. They start out at a 50-60 dB loss, and head south quickly from there. I'll post my new ones when I get them.

Just a follow up question.

Did you have an acoustic trauma or took any ototoxic medications shortly before these tests? Or has it been like this for a while?

 

[Ed209]

I don't know, I just think him and John have beef and it's only going to grow more and more because of these kind of antics. Ed brought Shim up, no one else brought him up. He did it all himself, by himself. Maybe they should go into the UFC and donate the money to funding for treating tinnitus.

John kept quoting me about Shim, but I ignored it all because this is what happens every time. I'm not sure what you mean about having beef with him. I don't hold grudges, but yea, in the past he has used abusive and vile language towards me and I let it let slide. As soon as I said something back I'm viewed as the bad guy. It's absurd after all the shit I've taken from him. I try and bury it and try to be civil but he starts dragging up shit from 8 months ago, I mean what's that all about?

It seems very one-sided in how all of this is viewed because I don't come on here to argue; I've got better things to do with my time. He may have beef with me because his behaviour can be bizarre. I'm not sure what else I can add that's of value anymore.

 

[GlennAz]

Did you have an acoustic trauma or took any ototoxic medications shortly before these tests? Or has it been like this for a while?

I don't know of any trauma. I've had ringing since I remember. No ototoxic meds.

 

[Jack Straw]

I don't know of any trauma. I've had ringing since I remember. No ototoxic meds.

All your life? Me too!

How old are you? If it's not too personal.

 

[GlennAz]

I'm 65.

 

[just1morething]

Maybe it's time to bury the hatchet on any harsh arguments. I just want to know the end results about tinnitus and hearing loss improvements from Dr. Shim's treatment. John and Glenn can give a thumbs up or thumbs down regarding their treatment eventually. The pricing is a whole other matter.

 

[Daniel Lion]

Hi guys, knock off the name calling, it doesn't help anyone, and we are all suffering.

Science involves discourse and explanations.

@Artemis2K, the pricing doesn't make sense. Fewer injections for twice the price is ILLOGICAL. But I would never call you a name, nor John or Ed.

My mom is an epidemiologist, actually very accomplished in her field, but she knows little about any of this except what I have written her. I had her read the thread... the name calling and abusive language detracts from the discussion of science and clouds everything.

I was actually the person who politely brought up the inconsistencies of the pricing, I'm a nice guy, and I'm sure John and Ed are too.

We should be able to discuss, disagree, agree, be confused, have clarity, in a civil and kind manner.

What is science without questioning, this is not a religious service where the doctrine is the "word of god", this is science developed and practiced by us mortals.

Any sound belief or idea can stand up to questioning and hold its own. That's why the best theories stand until proven wrong or tweaked to be even better.

Anyways I'm not blaming anyone, but trying to get my mom (who was once the president of the epidemiological society of America, has published in medical journals countless times) on board, which is very difficult with the name calling and abusive language.

It detracts from what could be good intellectual discourse.
My loss, not yours, so no worries.

I still hope @JohnAdams ears are healed and @GlennAz is doing better.

Sincerely, Daniel

 

[Daniel Lion]

Hey, @JohnAdams, just learned that you went to Korea again.
Welcome back.

Did you get bone marrow with the PRP?

It really sounds like this process should be done repeatedly over months, not crammed into two weeks. Bad for folks outside of Korea... Did you ever have any luck talking to your ENT about performing the procedure in the United States?

 

[Clint Azzopardi]

I thought that everyone is on the same boat here, yet somehow we end up throwing insults at each other.

No wonder war exists in this world.

 

[Ed209]

Maybe it's time to bury the hatchet on any harsh arguments.

I never came here to argue and I don't call people names, that's not my style and never has been. However, John doesn't debate, he takes things personally if a counterpoint is made and before you know it he's wishing death upon you amongst other charming insults (all deleted). I was going to keep my Shim convo off this forum out of respect for John but then I became tired of his antics and figured I may as well post it.

Hi guys, knock off the name calling, it doesn't help anyone, and we are all suffering.

Science involves discourse and explanations.

That's my only crime: debate. It's not welcome on here.

I was actually the person who politely brought up the inconsistencies of the pricing, I'm a nice guy, and I'm sure John and Ed are too.

I brought up the pricing issue ages ago (the moment he doubled it, and before that, even) but bizarre excuses were made for Shim and still are.

Before I disappear into the void I hope all the lurkers of this thread take serious note.

Do not hand over any money to Dr Shim until he publishes his successful study from 2014 (it will never happen). He doesn't take any credit cards (I wonder why); he only takes direct transfers. To the less informed, he obviously does this so that there's no chance of a dispute where you can claim your money back. Reputable businesses always take credit cards.

This post is just over 2 years old and yet he is now charging people $18,000 and still demands a non-refundable deposit.

There is absolutely no science backing this up and yet this man wants you to front large amounts of money without asking any questions. He hates questions about his treatment, funny that isn't it? It's a case of 'give me your money and shut up', and I'm sure once that happens he becomes your best friend whilst he waits for your next payment. He constantly references a useless patent that he has over actual scientific evidence, and he does this to give his treatment an air of authenticity to fool gullible and desperate people.

Do not be fooled!

Having access to only two anecdotal reports (which cannot even be verified) is not good enough. We have clinical trials to prove a treatment is better than placebo which is actually hard to achieve because the placebo effect is very powerful. I can only imagine that it's even more potent if you've just spent thousands of dollars on something.

There is no way of proving the legitimacy of this post, but it does make me wonder because it does sound like the kind of thing Shim would discuss (having spoken to him).

In all honesty, I cannot believe he is still relevant. I just don't want to see other people having their money taken from them in this way, out of desperation. For some, adding a financial burden of this magnitude could ruin their lives and Shim isn't interested in discussing payment options. He just wants your money.

With that cleared up, I hope that anyone reading this does find some peace of mind again and that you all manage to overcome your respective tinnitus problems.

Take care folks.

 

[another sean]

I don't get why there is such a witch hunt for Dr. Shim. I didn't see this kinda of witch hunt with Dr. Wilden and his laser or Stem Cells 21 and their $30k+ treatment. So far, at most, I've seen Dr. Shim guilty of raising his prices for profit. That isn't a crime and that doesn't mean his therapy doesn't work. And the 2 members who have actually gone, with actual first experience, had a positive experience overall and one so far has seen positive results and another is still waiting. But my god, he's being treated like he robbed everyone on the board, already. If there is proof his therapy doesn't work, I'd like to see it. Where are the angry locals? He's been operating for years in Korea, right? So does anyone have links to Korean media stating this guy is a quack and taking advantage of people with tinnitus? If he was, there must be something out there. I think proof is required on both sides. Otherwise it's partially a leap of faith due to few first hand accounts on this board, but a good one since PRP is a proven therapy in other fields.

I don't mind debates with facts to occur, but this toxicity has got to go. I feel the two members who have gone to see Dr. Shim have discussed their experience in a fairly objective manner and haven't flooded this thread with pie in the sky promises.

 

[Jack Straw]

@JohnAdams you went back again?! Was there a reason? How much was the second trip?

 

[Jazzer]

"I don't believe it!
I just don't believe it!!

There's a real 'spat' going on here,
and guess what - it's nothing to do with me !!"

 

[JohnAdams]

Was there a reason?

My ear was on fire from a new acoustic trauma. I'm actually very glad that I went back too. Could it have subsided again on its own? Maybe. I was very spoiled on my improvement though and I was in the acute stage with my new trauma so I just went for it. One thing I've learned from all this so far is that when, not if, but when nerve and haircell regeneration hits the mainstream, we will have to be even more careful with our ears because the new synapses will definitely not be as strong as the ones we are born with. That's a fact.

Despite the perpetual naysaying from Ed209, I have definitely experienced a dramatic improvement in my tinnitus level. So every time he gets on this thread with his endless nagging, he is basically insinuating that I am a liar or delusional, and he is the type of child that insults a person and then when they insult back, plays the victim. That is a form of deception and truly disgusting personality trait. I have always been 100% honest and forthcoming about everything, because I have absolutely no incentive to lie to or deceive any of you.

 

[Jack Straw]

My ear was on fire from a new acoustic trauma. I'm actually very glad that I went back too. Could it have subsided again on its own? Maybe. I was very spoiled on my improvement though and I was in the acute stage with my new trauma so I just went for it. One thing I've learned from all this so far is that when, not if, but when nerve and haircell regeneration hits the mainstream, we will have to be even more careful with our ears because the new synapses will definitely not be as strong as the ones we are born with. That's a fact.

Are you referring to the ear kiss?

Would you consider this a redo of the last treatment? Or a "touch up" of the previous one?

Was the price the same? If so, how can you afford to pay for such expensive treatments? I don't think I could have afforded to do this twice.

 

[Ray552]

Despite the perpetual naysaying from Ed209, I have definitely experienced a dramatic improvement in my tinnitus level. So every time he gets on this thread with his endless nagging, he is basically insinuating that I am a liar or delusional, and he is the type of child that insults a person and then when they insult back, plays the victim. That is a form of deception and truly disgusting personality trait. I have always been 100% honest and forthcoming about everything, because I have absolutely no incentive to lie to or deceive any of you.

Was there dramatic improvement in your hearing too just from casual observation like in daily life?

 

[JohnAdams]

Was there dramatic improvement in your hearing too just from casual observation like in daily life?

Yes. Especially in music. There were certain parts of songs and concertos that I couldn't hear as well or at all, and these were pieces that I've been listening to for years. As my recovery progressed the level of detail in the music and my ability to discern different instruments separately increased. Also my ability to distinguish sounds in my environment increased. For instance when my wife would be talking to me with my son's cartoons playing, I almost couldn't understand a word she was saying, and as time went by, I could definitely pick her voice out of the background more easily.

 

[FGG]

Here's how I think Minbo Shim's therapy works.

First off, this is how hair cell regeneration technology works.

A class of chemicals called notch inhibitors or gamma secretase inhibitors makes contact with the surface of the stem cell. The stem cells in our inner ear are classified as LGR5+ (positive), meaning that it expresses a gene called Leucine-rich repeat-containing G-protein coupled receptor 5.

Inside the cell there is a protein called Beta-Catenin. This is the switch.

Yes. Especially in music. There were certain parts of songs and concertos that I couldn't hear as well or at all, and these were pieces that I've been listening to for years. As my recovery progressed the level of detail in the music and my ability to discern different instruments separately increased. Also my ability to distinguish sounds in my environment increased. For instance when my wife would be talking to me with my son's cartoons playing, I almost couldn't understand a word she was saying, and as time went by, I could definitely pick her voice out of the background more easily.

Thanks for the explanation. It would seem like you are saying that especially your synapses recovered well.

Omg. I would do anything to be able listen to music again.

If notch inhibition is the key, perhaps Audion will have great (and hopefully eventually cheaper) news for us in December.

 

[Agatha]

 

[JohnAdams]

Here's how I think Minbo Shim's therapy works. He didn't explain this to me, I put all of this together myself.

First off, this is how hair cell regeneration technology works.

A class of chemicals called notch inhibitors or gamma secretase inhibitors makes contact with the surface of the stem cell. The stem cells in our inner ear are classified as LGR5+ (positive), meaning that it expresses a gene called Leucine-rich repeat-containing G-protein coupled receptor 5.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGR5

Inside the cell there is a protein called Beta-Catenin. This is the finger that throws the "switch" that makes LGR5+ stem cells proliferate, which means divide and regenerate into mature cells, in this case, hair cells in the cochlea. In order for this to occur, enough Beta-Catenin has to enter into the nucleus of the cell.

But, the reason our hair cells aren't regenerating on their own is because once Beta-Catenin is created inside the cell, there is a group of proteins that form something called the Beta-Catenin destruction complex, this destroys the Beta-Catenin before it can enter into the nucleus in enough quantity to activate the proliferation process.

The β-catenin destruction complex.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23169527


One way to stop the Beta-Catenin from being destroyed is by activating a cellular signalling pathway called WNT (pronounced wint).

Generation of hair cells in neonatal mice by β-catenin overexpression in Lgr5-positive cochlear progenitors.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23918377

This is how drugs like FX-322 work to "wake up" dormant stem cells in the inner ear.

There is a class of proteins involved with many functions in our bodies called growth factors.

One of these growth factors is called insulin-like growth factor 1. IGF-1.

IGF-1 has been shown in multiple human clinical trials to improve hearing recovery.


Insulin-like growth factor 1: A novel treatment for the protection or regeneration of cochlear hair cells.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25937136

Actually I never noticed this part before but they verified that it causes cochlear supporting cells to proliferate in cochlear explants.

"The mechanisms of IGF1-induced maintenance of hair cell number have been investigated using a cochlear explant culture system, which demonstrated that IGF1 acts on supporting cells, leading to the inhibition of hair cell apoptosis and the proliferation of supporting cells."


Another study, showed that IGF-1 increases cellular Beta-Catenin levels.

Insulin and IGF-1 stimulate the β-catenin pathway through two signalling cascades involving GSK-3β inhibition and Ras activation

https://www.nature.com/articles/1204064

"IGF-1 increased the cytoplasmic levels of β-catenin."



IGF-1 is produced in our bodies, in part in blood platelets.

There is not any blood in our inner ear fluid. Inner ear fluid is different from blood.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endolymph

You can create a platelet rich composition of blood by putting drawn blood in a centrifuge which separates the platelets into something called platelet rich plasma, PRP.
PRP contains growth factors, including IGF-1.

The growth factors and other cytokines present in PRP include:

• platelet-derived growth factor
• transforming growth factor beta
• fibroblast growth factor
• insulin-like growth factor 1
• insulin-like growth factor 2
• vascular endothelial growth factor
• epidermal growth factor
• Interleukin 8
• keratinocyte growth factor
• connective tissue growth factor

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Platelet-rich_plasma


In your middle ear there is a semi-permeable membrane called the round window.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Round_window


So that's how you can deliver medicine to the cochlea, by filling up the middle ear, via eardrum injection, with a viscous solution containing X substance, it rests in the middle ear and the substance, if molecularly small enough, will diffuse through the round window membrane. That's why the various presentations produced by FrequencyTX, as well as their homepage emphasize that their products are "small molecule drugs", because this is exactly how FX-322 is delivered to the cochlea.

Other neurotrophic compounds are also being investigated to repair lost cochlear synapses by diffusion through the round window membrane.

Round-window delivery of neurotrophin 3 regenerates cochlear synapses after acoustic overexposure
https://www.researchgate.net/public...cochlear_synapses_after_acoustic_overexposure


So that's my theory, that IGF-1 works just like FX-322 to disable the Beta-Catenin destruction complex and cause the stem cells to proliferate into functioning hair cells except that IGF-1 is already produced in our bodies and needs to be manually introduced into the cochlea. Also PRP may be much safer than FX-322 because it is good for healing holes to the eardrum that would be caused by the injection.


Topical use of autologous platelet rich plasma in myringoplasty.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25794691

"Topical autologous PRP application during myringoplasty is safe and highly efficient and successful with no reported complication"

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25794691

Now watch the nay-sayers purposefully push this post up the page with extremely long-winded ad-hominem attacks on me and Minbo Shim.

 

[Artemis2K]

I never came here to argue and I don't call people names, that's not my style and never has been. However, John doesn't debate, he takes things personally if a counterpoint is made and before you know it he's wishing death upon you amongst other charming insults (all deleted). I was going to keep my Shim convo off this forum out of respect for John but then I became tired of his antics and figured I may as well post it.

That's my only crime: debate. It's not welcome on here.

I brought up the pricing issue ages ago (the moment he doubled it, and before that, even) but bizarre excuses were made for Shim and still are.

Before I disappear into the void I hope all the lurkers of this thread take serious note.

Do not hand over any money to Dr Shim until he publishes his successful study from 2014 (it will never happen). He doesn't take any credit cards (I wonder why); he only takes direct transfers. To the less informed, he obviously does this so that there's no chance of a dispute where you can claim your money back. Reputable businesses always take credit cards.

View attachment 29613

This post is just over 2 years old and yet he is now charging people $18,000 and still demands a non-refundable deposit.

There is absolutely no science backing this up and yet this man wants you to front large amounts of money without asking any questions. He hates questions about his treatment, funny that isn't it? It's a case of 'give me your money and shut up', and I'm sure once that happens he becomes your best friend whilst he waits for your next payment. He constantly references a useless patent that he has over actual scientific evidence, and he does this to give his treatment an air of authenticity to fool gullible and desperate people.

Do not be fooled!

Having access to only two anecdotal reports (which cannot even be verified) is not good enough. We have clinical trials to prove a treatment is better than placebo which is actually hard to achieve because the placebo effect is very powerful. I can only imagine that it's even more potent if you've just spent thousands of dollars on something.

View attachment 29614

There is no way of proving the legitimacy of this post, but it does make me wonder because it does sound like the kind of thing Shim would discuss (having spoken to him).

In all honesty, I cannot believe he is still relevant. I just don't want to see other people having their money taken from them in this way, out of desperation. For some, adding a financial burden of this magnitude could ruin their lives and Shim isn't interested in discussing payment options. He just wants your money.

With that cleared up, I hope that anyone reading this does find some peace of mind again and that you all manage to overcome your respective tinnitus problems.

Take care folks.

In your attempt to try debating about Shim, you ignore Glenn and John's experience and *results*. Both have claimed positive results. You ignore this, and go straight to implying that Shim is dishonest. It's almost as if you are calling them liars. John has said that he'll post his full result when he can. He promised that he wouldn't do that until three months after he got back. There are multiple factors of why he can't give results so quickly, as the treatment effects have to fully mature. This isn't a thing where you get treated and immediately get better.

Quite honestly, I can see why John doesn't care for you. You come off as condescending and have talked down on him in the past, making assumptions about his intelligence without knowing his background. Now you are making claims that Shim isn't honest despite how much John has actually engaged with him and talked about the entire treatment. You are making accusations behind the computer and haven't gone through what John has. Instead of jumping into accusations, might I suggest asking John for when he thinks he'll be able to post his audiograms? This would work out a lot better than being impatient and impulsive with your accusations.

It's not like John has provided nothing. Despite making a commitment not to post his audiograms yet until it was time, he has provided his experience and the results he perceived. There is also Glenn who has posted about his experience that I was surprised by after thinking it would be much harder for older individuals.

I can understand your concerns, but it seems your are ignoring very important details about John's experience, and are prematurely making accusations. Please, just be patient, and try to change your tune about this? You'd probably get a lot better response from John if you did. I don't think the way you are going about this is helping.

 

[JohnAdams]

Do not hand over any money to Dr Shim

Why don't you stop being such a bossy know it all?

He called me "stupid" and "bonkers"

I think the stupidest thing I've heard on here is that someone actually paid Dr Shim. Very brave, but totally bonkers.

Then I called him

a schizophrenic moron.

Then he said

Why do you always feel the need to attack and be insulting?

How about:
Do not take any advice from a person that insults people and then when he is insulted back cries about it and plays the victim. It is a tactic that schizophrenics and manipulative people use and is a totally disgusting personality trait.

 

[Agatha]

Do not take any advice from a person that insults people and then when he is insulted back cries about it and plays the victim. It is a tactic that schizophrenics and manipulative people use and is a totally disgusting personality trait.

Totally not the same thing. You were the one being insulting, JohnAdams.

Minbo Shim has not provided any scientific publications or evidence to support his claims. Therefore, to pay him $18,000 is INSANE!!! BONKERS!!!

I can't read this topic, how you people fall for this sham "doctor" makes my brain spin in confusion.

 

[JohnAdams]

Totally not the same thing. You were the one being insulting, JohnAdams.

So insulting me isn't insulting me. What kind of idiotic logic is that???

Minbo Shim has not provided any scientific publications or evidence to support his claims. Therefore, to pay him $18,000 is INSANE!!! BONKERS!!!

I can't read this topic, how you people fall for this sham "doctor" makes my brain spin in confusion.

First off, your meme sucks, which reveals your lack of intelligence. Secondly, you have no idea what you're talking about. You guys are basically weaving together a conspiracy that involves medical fraud, and some motivation for me to lie about my experience, none of which you have any evidence for, which is what you hypocrites are demanding from Minbo in the first place.

 

[JohnAdams]

Are you referring to the ear kiss?

Yes.

Would you consider this a redo of the last treatment? Or a "touch up" of the previous one?

New trauma, new frequency of tinnitus, totally unrelated to the previous treatment. However, my left ear wasn't nearly as improved as my right ear so hopefully this one boosts the overall recovery up.

 

[Artemis2K]

Totally not the same thing. You were the one being insulting, JohnAdams.

Minbo Shim has not provided any scientific publications or evidence to support his claims. Therefore, to pay him $18,000 is INSANE!!! BONKERS!!!

I can't read this topic, how you people fall for this sham "doctor" makes my brain spin in confusion.

I spent hundreds of hours going through his credibility. He is a genuine doctor that has even met Dr. Stefan Heller, has been sponsored by the Russian government, has traveled around the world for medical research, and does in fact have credible papers of his profession. In addition, if you actually do research, the science behind his method is sound, and John and Glenn have both said that they have had good results.

 

[JohnAdams]

I just posted exactly how I think this works on a molecular level. There is no secret here. Any of you can research this and take it to an ENT and try and convince them to attempt this on you. PRP eardrum injections don't need FDA approval because PRP isn't regulated. There have been studies on IGF-1 and IGF-1 is in PRP. It seems like there is a role for mesenchymal stem cells from bone marrow in this too, perhaps a process called paracrine.

So there you have it. Now how could I be trying to push a scam when I'm not even pushing people to go to Minbo's clinic per se? I've given out the recipe. I am clearly trying to share knowledge of a viable treatment for our damn tinnitus. Maybe Minbo has more experience and has tweaked his treatment a little that makes it better, but nonetheless, this treatment is open source.

There is no fraud here. The treatment worked for me. Ed209 and Agatha can take a hike. Get brave/motivated and take this info to an ENT and try and talk them into doing it to you. Or fly to Korea if you want. That's the beauty of all of this, is that Ed209 is not our King and we can do whatever we want.

The best case they can make is that I am delusional and trying to get people to get eardrum injections of PRP, because uh, muh reasons?

I am in the process of slowly putting together a more formal write-up about PRP in the treatment of hearing loss and I will share this freely with all of you, even Ed209.

I'll tell you what is a scam though, funding mindfulness studies.

 

[spedgas]

I'm not questioning if @JohnAdams thinks his hearing and tinnitus has improved. I can't hear through his ears.

However, until something other than one random guy on the intranet supports this I'm viewing it as a placebo.

For as much effort and money as he has put into researching this and making fun of those who question it of course he feels like it's improved his situation.

He has hyped it up in his own mind so much he's convinced it's effective.