Suicidal

[bobvann]

Your feelings of cowardice are completely misplaced and might be the result of of the victim shaming that tinnitus sufferers are all too familiar with.
What you have is likely the most horrid condition a human being can get, as we are not really designed for this type of torture.

That guy may not have his arm, but I bet you he can relax and sleep like a baby, where he wakes up refreshed the next day, ready to face any new challenges.

If he (or anyone else for that matter) had on average 2 hour sleep per night (if you can even call it that) due to screaming tinnitus every single day with no relief and no hope of getting better, I can guarantee you that he would not be sitting behind that drum set (or really doing much of anything).

I would gladly trade him my arm for my tinnitus.
I would even throw in a leg, if I had to.
Then I could spend the rest of my life in peace, reading, writing, socializing, enjoying beautiful sunsets, listening to music, or feeding ducks by the pond, without screeching metal factory inside my head wrecking all of it.
Not to mention collecting some form of disability would be quite easy, compared to Tinnitus, where you get none.

It's not cowardice you should be feeling.
Personally, I would feel envy (as I do feel often, when seeing visibly disabled people, knowing I would happily take their place in a heartbeat, in exchange for silence).

I know what you mean. I was just stating how fucked up this is. It is more then simply victim blaming / shaming.

But hey! According to some out there it's just a benign sound that is driven by emotion. Rigghhhhhtt.

 

[FGG]

Your feelings of cowardice are completely misplaced and might be the result of of the victim shaming that tinnitus sufferers are all too familiar with.
What you have is likely the most horrid condition a human being can get, as we are not really designed for this type of torture.

That guy may not have his arm, but I bet you he can relax and sleep like a baby, where he wakes up refreshed the next day, ready to face any new challenges.

If he (or anyone else for that matter) had on average 2 hour sleep per night (if you can even call it that) due to screaming tinnitus every single day with no relief and no hope of getting better, I can guarantee you that he would not be sitting behind that drum set (or really doing much of anything).

I would gladly trade him my arm for my tinnitus.
I would even throw in a leg, if I had to.
Then I could spend the rest of my life in peace, reading, writing, socializing, enjoying beautiful sunsets, listening to music, or feeding ducks by the pond, without screeching metal factory inside my head wrecking all of it.
Not to mention collecting some form of disability would be quite easy, compared to Tinnitus, where you get none.

It's not cowardice you should be feeling.
Personally, I would feel envy (as I do feel often, when seeing visibly disabled people, knowing I would happily take their place in a heartbeat, in exchange for silence).

Society definitely likes to victim blame "invisible" illness more. Perhaps because people can't be as readily called out on their lack of empathy.

I would cut off both of my own legs myself if it would heal my ears and I would happily "bootstrap" my way into a peaceful and productive life afterward.

Losing a limb is profoundly effecting no doubt but it doesn't involve a constant assault on your senses unless you have severe phantom limb pain.

 

[DaveFromChicago]

To FGG:
Once again, very insightful. For decades, Medical Science also essentially ignored headaches (even severe and Migraine) because they too were "invisible." It was only until there were so many suicides from Migraines that real research was conducted. It seems as if there is a cruelly, stupid assumption that a condition does not actually exist unless it will physically manifest itself.

 

[FGG]

To FGG:
Once again, very insightful. For decades, Medical Science also essentially ignored headaches (even severe and Migraine) because they too were "invisible." It was only until there were so many suicides from Migraines that real research was conducted. It seems as if there is a cruelly, stupid assumption that a condition does not actually exist unless it will physically manifest itself.

Agree. It's sick and very pervasive. There was a time when fibromyalgia was literally called the "yuppie flu."

I can't tell you how many "well you don't look anxious and depressed..." I have gotten.

 

[PeteJ]

Depends on your definition of close. Our first generation of regenerative medicine is on pace to be here in ~5 years. But I can understand that still feeling like a lifetime for a severe sufferer like you.

The ENTs you speak of aren't the same people as the researchers developing regenerative medicine. Let's not conflate the two. ENTs may be the ones that will administer the treatments on the frontlines, but their profession has nothing to do with how far away researchers are from releasing their products. Although I do agree with you that ENTs are mostly useless when it comes to hearing problems. Researchers, however, are so far ahead of the game. They've got drugs in clinical trials to treat cochlear synaptopathy, a condition which hasn't even been naturalized into the ENTs diagnostic textbook.

People have different ears and different conditions of their ears.

Is regenerative medicine going to treat them all? Will it even affect tinnitus? What about hyperacusis or ear pain? You seem overly positive and optimistic based on what? I don't know of any information out there to support this optimism and you are right, the time frame doesn't help at all. Five years, ten years, it's all like never to me. Pure fiction. :-(

 

[Contrast]

I'm trying to get out in a week or two.

LET NO ONE SAY MY SUICIDE IS NOT JUSTIED.

 

[MrCrybaby]

People have different ears and different conditions of their ears.

Is regenerative medicine going to treat them all? Will it even affect tinnitus? What about hyperacusis or ear pain? You seem overly positive and optimistic based on what? I don't know of any information out there to support this optimism and you are right, the time frame doesn't help at all. Five years, ten years, it's all like never to me. Pure fiction. :-(

It's tempting to think your ears are an extra special edge case that will simply not be helped, but that's very unlikely. By regenerating the ears lots of bad brain plasticity will like be reversed (central gain) which has a ripple effect on things like middle ear muscle behaviour (hyperactivity is believed to irritate the trigeminal nerve leading to face pain) and perceived sound loudness and maybe even tinnitus. We, unfortunately need to wait for the second phase results from FX 322 to get an answer on if things work as hypothesized.

 

[linearb]

I'm trying to get out in a week or two.

LET NO ONE SAY MY SUICIDE IS NOT JUSTIED.

who cares if it's justified or not?

If you kill yourself, I could easily spend the next five years saying mean shit about you on here. Why would that possibly matter to you?

 

[linearb]

People have different ears and different conditions of their ears.

Yes.

Is regenerative medicine going to treat them all?

Hell no.

Will it even affect tinnitus?

no one knows

What about hyperacusis or ear pain?

people know this even less.

Five years, ten years, it's all like never to me.

Unbridled, unwarranted pessimism. I'm 20 years in; if you told me I'd be cured in 10 I'd say "neat, I'm 2/3 there!"

Pure fiction. :-(

Untrue, multiple things being tested in live humans as we speak, with more things in various points in the pre-human clinical phases.

Did you ever have a response to the long post I wrote, Pete? You said something about trying to reply when you were in a better state of mind, IIRC

 

[Contrast]

These anti suicide groups are dominated with PSYCHOLOGIST and they don't think about health problems, just mental ones. They can always address poor behavior caused by shit health, and act like the behavior is all that matters.

Just remember, we aren't the only ones getting clowned on by elite NIH funded psychologist

 

[linearb]

These anti suicide groups are dominated with PSYCHOLOGIST and they don't think about health problems, just mental ones.

[citations needed]

also you are making some kind of cartesian split between "mind" and "body, nerves, brain" when in fact no such thing exits; "mind" is simply a reflection of the state "body, nerves, and brain" are in. Also that is a two way street, there's a wealth of data showing how conscious behavior influences neurological change I am not sure why people find that idea so hard to grasp when a hundred papers have been published on it in the last ten years and there are a number of great books summarizing it, including Selfless Insight, written by a PhD neurologist.

I dunno what your point is dude. If you wanna end yourself, no one is stopping you.

If you're wondering why the "anti suicide" crowd seems so much louder than the "pro suicide" crowd, I would humbly suggest that you just use logic to parse that. People who are legitimately "pro suicide" are a lot less likely to be here with us than people who are not in favor of ending themselves. This is not a conspiracy.

 

[Christopher805]

NIH psychologist need to take behavioral therapy than maybe they would not make such ridiculous claims. Always what the patient is not doing.

 

[Contrast]

[citations needed]

also you are making some kind of cartesian split between "mind" and "body, nerves, brain" when in fact no such thing exits; "mind" is simply a reflection of the state "body, nerves, and brain" are in. Also that is a two way street, there's a wealth of data showing how conscious behavior influences neurological change I am not sure why people find that idea so hard to grasp when a hundred papers have been published on it in the last ten years and there are a number of great books summarizing it, including Selfless Insight, written by a PhD neurologist.

I dunno what your point is dude. If you wanna end yourself, no one is stopping you.

If you're wondering why the "anti suicide" crowd seems so much louder than the "pro suicide" crowd, I would humbly suggest that you just use logic to parse that. People who are legitimately "pro suicide" are a lot less likely to be here with us than people who are not in favor of ending themselves. This is not a conspiracy.

I'm not a dualist.

I'm agnostic on panpsychism vs materialism. For matter to be experiencing anything in the first place it might have a subjective property.

Our brains are suggesting all matter has both mental and physical properties. Look at David Chalmers explanation of panpsychism and how it doesn't contradict neurological models. Read more on consciousness studies

 

[Zugzug]

I have had chronic illness for 5 years; for most of that time, I have suffered debilitating pain. I could not begin to explain how many doctors immediately jumped to psychology -- probably 25 out of the 30 doctors I saw. I've had autoimmune diseases (almost surely the cause of my life-altering hyperacusis), fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue syndrome, etc. floated around. But there's been such an emphasis on mental health, when in actuality, my flare ups go way beyond stressful times.

It's sad how much respect I've lost for the field. I used to LOVE psychology; I've even checked myself in for CBT in the past. I'm a strong believer in it for mental health problems.

But chronic illness has nothing to do with this field. I currently can't talk, leave my house, work, shower in peace, sleep well, type on a keyboard without earplugs and earmuffs, etc. I wonder why I have mental illness and unspeakable levels of depression. Hmmmm....it's probably because of my attitude.

Also, while the "chase for a cure" or the "chase for the right supplement combo" may be a waste of time, it sure as hell feels a lot better than "picture this being the rest of our life. Let's get used to it." The whole "get used to it" and "habituate" is excellent advice for someone with mental health problems. The working assumption, though, when you say this to someone with life-altering levels of torture is that they have a good life. If they were to flip places, they would get how insulting it is.

The ironic part is that it actually diminishes mental health problems as well. There are people who are perfectly healthy, but have such severe mental illness that they can't leave their bed. It's such an insult to their depression to say that I'm like them. I was a dominant Ph.D. student, ambitious, pretty happy, etc. before this. No, I don't know what it's like to have life going well for me and feel nothing inside. It is a different medical problem. It's time we stop getting in the way of everyone getting the help that they need.

 

[Contrast]

[citations needed]

also you are making some kind of cartesian split between "mind" and "body, nerves, brain" when in fact no such thing exits; "mind" is simply a reflection of the state "body, nerves, and brain" are in. Also that is a two way street, there's a wealth of data showing how conscious behavior influences neurological change I am not sure why people find that idea so hard to grasp when a hundred papers have been published on it in the last ten years and there are a number of great books summarizing it, including Selfless Insight, written by a PhD neurologist.

I dunno what your point is dude. If you wanna end yourself, no one is stopping you.

If you're wondering why the "anti suicide" crowd seems so much louder than the "pro suicide" crowd, I would humbly suggest that you just use logic to parse that. People who are legitimately "pro suicide" are a lot less likely to be here with us than people who are not in favor of ending themselves. This is not a conspiracy.

The problem with materalism is that they "Dawkins, Harris, Denette, Blackmore, are trying to explain consciousness away as an epiphenomenal illusion and we have no free will. (It's all genes) They have to say all that all art, music and culture in human history was generated by biochemical puppets without agency.

That's a mad position to defend!

I already explained a million times in MPP why the existence of free will (something lay people take for granted) is basically what scientist would require super natural shit or quantum physics to explain. That's why they label consciousness an illusion. They have no choice.

Even the well respected Quantum physicist Sean Carroll stated quantum randomness doesn't give us free will.

 

[KyleM]

(a lot).

Maybe you need to just find something that needs doing and get back to work work.

 

[Zugzug]

i won't be here much longer, the meme making software is pretty much done. The evidence is going to be shipped to the State of Hawaii tomorrow.

Obviously my input means nothing, but I just want you to know that you are an extremely valuable member of this community. There's a level of honesty that you speak about the issues that is rare. You have given me way more hope than the victim-blamers on here -- a hope that people stand up for themselves. You are miserable, but know that you help others.

 

[Contrast]

Obviously my input means nothing, but I just want you to know that you are an extremely valuable member of this community. There's a level of honesty that you speak about the issues that is rare. You have given me way more hope than the victim-blamers on here -- a hope that people stand up for themselves. You are miserable, but know that you help others.

That was a really kind comment!

 

[linearb]

I'm definitely not a materialist, but I'd like to see Dawkins cage fight Sam Harris, and then the winner gets shot

 

[Contrast]

I'm definitely not a materialist, but I'd like to see Dawkins cage fight Sam Harris, and then the winner gets shot

Someone needs to put LSD inside Dawkins tea.

Out of highschool I watched Dawkins segments on Youtube and was a fanboy. Now I'm looking at him like a skeptic.

 

[serendipity1996]

As soon as I listen to an artificial audio source (TV, radio, laptop, phone) my ears feel uncomfortable. Not loudness but pain hyperacusis. Well, not getting acute pain but ears feel tense, forehead tingling intensifies, and get mild ear prickling afterwards. It's like some bizarre sort of allergic reaction. And it's pretty much only artificial audio... no problems with face-to-face convo or normal environmental noise even cutlery. Artificial just seems to have this abrasive piercing quality to it. Am so frustrated. Feel like I have a v atypical case of hyperacusis. Beginning to feel cut-off from everything as haven't been able to watch any news, TV, YouTube, documentaries, listen to music for over 2 months. I'm a keen reader so it's not been the absolute end of the world but I'm just feeling so frustrated about it all.

 

[alanisnotadj]

I'm definitely not a materialist, but I'd like to see Dawkins cage fight Sam Harris, and then the winner gets shot

Have they fallen out?

 

[PeteJ]

The constant pain in my left ear and the joint with the upper cheekbone is just unbearable. I am so tired of this.

I don't know how long I can deal with this. Plus loud tinnitus.

I think it's a severe case of TMJ-like symptoms but doesn't seem to match others' here. Why are ENTs paid so much if they can't help with these conditions?!?

I think it's been over a week or two, straight, with severe ear pain and no relief or subsiding. Narcotics should be offered for pain like this. I was advised to consult pain clinics but each city/country is different and I don't see any mention of ear pain on online sites for pain management. I am afraid that they won't be willing to help me.

I also want a solution and if there isn't one, I ultimately WANT SUICIDE if that is the only way to stop this pain condition. The tinnitus is bad enough that I experience this, too!

 

[linearb]

Have they fallen out?

no idea, don't care, stand by the original quote

 

[Zugzug]

I think it's a severe case of TMJ-like symptoms but doesn't seem to match others' here. Why are ENTs paid so much if they can't help with these conditions?!?

Honestly, I'm less upset that ENTs can't help than I am that they don't report the truth back to the researchers and create some form of advocacy. Like imagine if every time one of us came to an ENT, they personally emailed the NIH and said they had another patient whose life is ruined and nothing can be done. That's a whole lot different from "See what the psychiatrist can do to calm you down!"

I've seen several high-level ENTs and I would bet every dollar I own that they never critically thought about my problem after a 5 minute meeting with me, where they recommended benzos, TRT, and lipoflavinoids.

I think it's been over a week or two, straight, with severe ear pain and no relief or subsiding. Narcotics should be offered for pain like this. I was advised to consult pain clinics but each city/country is different and I don't see any mention of ear pain on online sites for pain management. I am afraid that they won't be willing to help me.

Have you tried curcumin, CBD oil, or antidepressants? Of course, I'm not talking about for the problem, but for management for the fallout of the problem. I know some people have really bad results from these, but others may not.

I've had some success with curcumin and CBD oil, but I think it's because my problem is from a systemic illness. I'm not sure if they help (even anecdotally) for other causes.

 

[PeteJ]

Honestly, I'm less upset that ENTs can't help than I am that they don't report the truth back to the researchers and create some form of advocacy. I've seen several high-level ENTs and I would bet every dollar I own that they never critically thought about my problem after a 5 minute meeting with me, where they recommended benzos, TRT, and lipoflavinoids.


Have you tried curcumin, CBD oil, or antidepressants? Of course, I'm not talking about for the problem, but for management for the fallout of the problem. I know some people have really bad results from these, but others may not.

I've had some success with curcumin and CBD oil, but I think it's because my problem is from a systemic illness. I'm not sure if they help (even anecdotally) for other causes.

I don't have much money month to month so I haven't but I want to try curcumin and CBD oil since I have access to it, at least. I just don't know how I will buy it. So far, I have only tried amitriptyline.

How does any of that help with ear pain though?

My ear is also red from holding ice in a washcloth there.

 

[serendipity1996]

I don't have much money month to month so I haven't but I want to try curcumin and CBD oil since I have access to it, at least. I just don't know how I will buy it. So far, I have only tried amitriptyline.

How does any of that help with ear pain though?

My ear is also red from holding ice in a washcloth there.

Idk if this will be of any help but I know Myriam Westcott in Australia had one patient who had severe ear pain/face pain from TTTS and acoustic shock and found great relief in a stellate ganglion block and further nerve blocks using Botox. There's more discussion about it in the hyperacusis section but basically this person's pain has pretty much all but gone after multiple treatments. It's still pretty experimental at this stage obviously but Myriam is very quick to reply if you get in touch with her via email so maybe it's a possible option to explore?
Idk if this will be helpful, just putting it out there.

 

[Orions Pain]

The feelings of being so far removed out of normal life are so real. Anxiety is soul crushing

 

[RishRamsey]

Joining this thread - also signed up on a suicide forum, god help me!

Extreme pain and just getting setbacks and setbacks and setbacks, with actually no hope for improvement.

I really wish I lived alone, with no family, that way suicide would be easier.

On one hand it feels like a relief, like 1 day I can end this pain, but on the other hand, the idea of crushing my mother's soul is worse than this pain.

 

[Harley]

The feelings of being so far removed out of normal life are so real. Anxiety is soul crushing

That is a very good way to describe this condition.
Life and this level of tinnitus is mutually exclusive.

The world is now getting a tiny watered down sample of the isolation, that someone suffering from tinnitus/hyperacusis would go through (minus the 24/7 torture of course) and everyone is freaking out.

Now if they weren't able to sleep, relax, listen to music or even load the dishwasher without ear muffs, the world would go up in flames.

If tinnitus was transmitted same way like the coronavirus, it would put the world at a emergency lock-down stand still.

Looking for a cure would then suddenly become the #1 global priority, as the death rate from the suicides would far surpass any known virus or disease.