Suicidal

[Autumnly]

Since all people with hyperacusis can be helped by a behavioural approach with 'sound' therapy, it has become clear that the symptoms cannot be the result of irreversible ear damage.

WTH - ALL people!? How did people like Hazell ever get taken seriously??? I really hope we'll see a bigger patient movement eventually that pushes back against these incredibly harmful stereotypes like the ME/CFS community did and still does.

"That is because ALL that matters is your reaction to tinnitus (aversive conditioned response). You make it your enemy, and the brain is absolutely right to monitor it and dislike it. You make it your friend and you will only hear it when you wish and without displeasure."

These people should experience severe pain-hyperacusis and severe tinnitus.

 

[FGG]

WTH - ALL people!? How did people like Hazell ever get taken seriously??? I really hope we'll see a bigger patient movement eventually that pushes back against these incredibly harmful stereotypes like the ME/CFS community did and still does.

"That is because ALL that matters is your reaction to tinnitus (aversive conditioned response). You make it your enemy, and the brain is absolutely right to monitor it and dislike it. You make it your friend and you will only hear it when you wish and without displeasure."

These people should experience severe pain-hyperacusis and severe tinnitus.

The worst part for me is that they have to know this isn't true if they have even a shred of empathy and listen to their patients.

 

[Autumnly]

The worst part for me is that they have to know this isn't true if they have even a shred of empathy and listen to their patients.

I think so too... except if they've genuinely deluded themselves into believing all of this. The "Readers Email" section is just a massive amount of misinformation, can't believe that's their actual homepage.

Apparently your reaction prevents acute tinnitus from developing into chronic tinnitus:

• Tinnitus after ear syringing is very common. If patients are warned of this then they will not develop an aversive conditioned response and the tinnitus will not persist.

Reminds me of Rilana Cima comparing tinnitus distress to a spider phobia:

• Retraining is what all phobic/hypersensitivity states are about.
• Those who are aversive to tinnitus (or spiders) find it hard to believe that the majority don't react as they do. But that's the truth!.

Loudness doesn't matter and it's actually just your reaction that makes it louder, nothing else:

• Well, the loudness of tinnitus is not important , only your reaction to it. In fact it is your reaction +/- your fluctuation in your mood state, that makes it louder and more noticeable rather than the other way around. TRT will always be the answer, and the more practice you have had using it, the better the results.

Guys, it's just your unresolved trauma:

• The problem is not tinnitus, or your hearing, it is your phobic anxiety state, possibly rooted in childhood experiences and which has to be sorted out by you and your psychologist.

Hazell doesn't like Richard Tyler:

• I am sure that Rich Tyler will make his best and most unbiased effort to show how effective TRT is compared to other treatments..

Other lovely messages:

• The message is that, now, no one needs to suffer indefinitely.
• The problem is that most user groups, and even self help groups, are moaning clubs, giving aversive and phobic training – which makes everyone worse.
• The difference is that 'sufferers' have an aversive conditioned (Pavlovian style) reflex response to the sound their auditory system naturally generates.

 

[Orions Pain]

Yes, it's so aggravating. I also really dislike the way that hyperacusis, real painful hyperacusis seems to be conflated with fear of sound by some practitioners like you just need to get over your 'fear and anxiety around sounds' when actually the evidence is increasingly pointing to hyperacusis being a very real injury to the ear. I can't believe that the director of the Tinnitus and Hyperacuis Centre in London, Jonathan Hazell states this on his website:
http://tinnitus.org/hyperacusis-etc/?LMCL=pu5P1m

"Hyperacusis is due to an alteration in the central processing of sound in the auditory pathways where there is an abnormally strong reaction from exposure to moderate sound levels. The cochlea is often completely normal, although patients frequently wrongly believe it is irreversibly damaged. Traditional teaching involved only an understanding of 'recruitment' , the result of cochlea damage. Since all people with hyperacusis can be helped by a behavioural approach with 'sound' therapy, it has become clear that the symptoms cannot be the result of irreversible ear damage."

Most of the recent research, e.g. the finding of pain fibers in the cochlea and potential up-regulation of them after damage goes against this notion.

THIS!! I've called almost every hospital in my area to find out what kind of MRI machine they use to find a quiet one and each time they've told me "oh we will give you something for the anxiety!"

Like it isn't an anxiety issue you idiots!! I literally can not tolerate the decibel levels, it's not a mind thing!! This is like telling someone with a broken leg that they'll give them an energy drink to help run a marathon.

 

[Bartoli]

The worst part for me is that they have to know this isn't true if they have even a shred of empathy and listen to their patients.

They would just call you uncooperative and treatment-resistant. What baffles me most is the absolute certainty with which he states this... especially since he has been exposed to patients all his life as you say. Sad.

 

[Contrast]

I don't get why suicide is the worst thing that can happen, suffering is much worse.

 

[serendipity1996]

THIS!! I've called almost every hospital in my area to find out what kind of MRI machine they use to find a quiet one and each time they've told me "oh we will give you something for the anxiety!"

Like it isn't an anxiety issue you idiots!! I literally can not tolerate the decibel levels, it's not a mind thing!! This is like telling someone with a broken leg that they'll give them an energy drink to help run a marathon.

When I went to my GP to discuss my issue she actually asked me if I had been 'hearing voices lately.' Having anxiety disorder on your medical file can be really frustrating as if you present with a physical issue that they don't immediately understand it seems to get dismissed as iT's AlL iN yOuR hEaD' .

 

[Orions Pain]

When I went to my GP to discuss my issue she actually asked me if I had been 'hearing voices lately.' Having anxiety disorder on your medical file can be really frustrating as if you present with a physical issue that they don't immediately understand it seems to get dismissed as iT's AlL iN yOuR hEaD' .

Ugh I'm sorry. That is so frustrating. Because it's "invisible" if we don't show emotion and act normal then people just assume we're fine, but if we breakdown and show distress/anxiety then it's mental illness. There's absolutely no winning.

 

[FGG]

Ugh I'm sorry. That is so frustrating. Because it's "invisible" if we don't show emotion and act normal then people just assume we're fine, but if we breakdown and show distress/anxiety then it's mental illness. There's absolutely no winning.

It's victim blaming essentially.

 

[ASilverLight]

They would just call you uncooperative and treatment-resistant. What baffles me most is the absolute certainty with which he states this... especially since he has been exposed to patients all his life as you say. Sad.

This. I want to try TRT if it might help me just live life a bit better. But I've also been trying on my own and let me just say this. It's not about the fear. I hardly fear the noise. What I fear is my future. I'm only 23, what am I going to have to give up? Be mindful of? It seems nearly everything. And they don't seem to get that's MUCH more of an impact on your life than not having silence (even though that, too, is awful).

I love the comparison to a spider phobia. I'm terrified of spiders. When there's one in my room, it gets removed, problem solved. The noise can't be removed. Problem not solved.

Also, my childhood traumas are keeping me from healing? Lol. I was getting to a point where I was really, really starting to get over them - 2020 was going to be a turnaround year for me for MANY reasons. Instead, not even a week in, I get greeted with multi-tonal tinnitus that doesn't mask easily.

Forgive me for having a really hard time coping with that after all the BS life has already thrown at me in such a short time. Forgive me for wanting a cure or at least a real relief of the noise instead of ''learning not to fear the noise and making it my friend.''

I really don't fear it.

 

[Jazzer]

I don't get why suicide is the worst thing that can happen, suffering is much worse.

So true Contrast x

 

[Contrast]

The reason I'm so mad is because its obvious disabled people are being USED.


The state doesn't recognize them as disabled, this happens all over the board of health problems that are horrifying, not just tinnitus.

 

[Contrast]

Surgeries to decompress muscles in cases in special nerve damage cases are avoided because of risk.


Medicine is all about AVOIDING RISK, and PLAYING IT SAFE, The papers I have read on pub med make it clear the cheapest option is better (due to the disabiity being a burden. Reversing biological damage requires taking risk. Risk is something they avoid.

 

[Contrast]

People trying to prevent suicide seem to be in favour of resilience propaganda. Anti suicide groups don't advocate for biomedical research, nor do they talk much about physical health problems.

They only focus on depression and mental health problems which are very important for some, but they don't cover our niche of physical suffering.

 

[Contrast]

I've never came across academic literature that encouraged people with horrifying health problems to get disability income. The papers first mention that X disease is an economic burden and that CBT can save the day.

 

[Orions Pain]

More than anything I'm missing the feeling of freedom. Buying concert tickets without second thought, saying yes to a vacation getaway and walking around an unfamiliar area without fearing noise, putting on a new song in the car on my way to work without worrying about the burning feeling in my ears, walking into a bar and enjoying a drink without worrying about sound.

Being SO restricted from things people my age get to enjoy without second thought is beyond frustrating. I'm so exhausted of ALL of this.

 

[Contrast]

The reason I am leaving is because I don't have any options left. I can't bullshit my way out of this mess.

 

[Kriszti]

More than anything I'm missing the feeling of freedom. Buying concert tickets without second thought, saying yes to a vacation getaway and walking around an unfamiliar area without fearing noise, putting on a new song in the car on my way to work without worrying about the burning feeling in my ears, walking into a bar and enjoying a drink without worrying about sound.

Being SO restricted from things people my age get to enjoy without second thought is beyond frustrating. I'm so exhausted of ALL of this.

This. And that's what people don't understand. That this fear is not irrational. It's our reality.

Everything I enjoy either requires quiet which is hard because of tinnitus, or too loud which has a potential to ruin my ears even further.

I want to live, I just don't want a life full of suffering.

 

[serendipity1996]

WTH - ALL people!? How did people like Hazell ever get taken seriously??? I really hope we'll see a bigger patient movement eventually that pushes back against these incredibly harmful stereotypes like the ME/CFS community did and still does.

"That is because ALL that matters is your reaction to tinnitus (aversive conditioned response). You make it your enemy, and the brain is absolutely right to monitor it and dislike it. You make it your friend and you will only hear it when you wish and without displeasure."

These people should experience severe pain-hyperacusis and severe tinnitus.

The way they talk about TRT is so unsettling... it's like a cult mentality where it's held up as some infallible cure-all. Rather than just accepting that it's a bog-standard medical treatment that may or may not help people.

 

[serendipity1996]

This. And that's what people don't understand. That this fear is not irrational. It's our reality.

Everything I enjoy either requires quiet which is hard because of tinnitus, or too loud which has a potential to ruin my ears even further.

I want to live, I just don't want a life full of suffering.

Totally agree. And people say 'just avoid loud noise' like wHaT a GeNiuS iDeA!!
It's like you have to pre-emptively mentally deconstruct every single mundane situation in your life to avoid setting off your tinnitus and hyperacusis. It's so exhausting.

 

[Contrast]

Meanwhile shit for brains at the VA are thinking about CBT and ACT to treat us. The BTA even now recommends MTRT (modified TRT) I do a much better job calling out tinnitus snake oil then the BTA.

 

[Tweedleman]

Is there lists on here of possible things to reduce tinnitus volume? E.g. drugs like benzos etc.?

So far 0.5mg clonazepam hasn't reduced volume, not sure if a higher dose would make a difference. 25mg amitriptyline didn't do shit for my tinnitus either. Although the relaxing effects of both are nice. I tried many supplements and they all did even less for me.

Cyanide is probably our best option in 2020.

 

[Contrast]

Anti Suicide people are like zealots that don't understand our suffering.


Recognition of volition shatters the mechanistic materialistic world view. Denial of it puts me in a scenario where I have no control and my suicide was determined by the cosmos.

 

[Contrast]

Look at the Corona Virus as an example. All the economic stimulus checks in the world won't change that the interaction between living cells and a novel virus is not well enough understood by science.

 

[PeteJ]

This. And that's what people don't understand. That this fear is not irrational. It's our reality.

Everything I enjoy either requires quiet which is hard because of tinnitus, or too loud which has a potential to ruin my ears even further.

I want to live, I just don't want a life full of suffering.

Loud tinnitus makes even avoiding quiet places unbearable - because even quiet places are interrupted by this fucking excruciatingly LOUD tinnitus, so loud that it seems like it's coming from outside. I have ear pain even if there isn't a loud noise. I am told it's probably tmj but the pain subsided for a while recently. I can't explain it but the pain recently returned although it's not severe. But, it still reminds me that my ears are damaged.

I think the tinnitus is the worst part simply because of the volume and number of tones. It's excruciatingly loud and is torture. Nothing helps so I was wondering if anyone found something that they think reduces the volume for them. I don't assume it would work for me but I need something or I will be dead eventually. If not today, at some time. I would prefer a volume reduction or cure but I don't foresee any relief. I think my volume is uniquely loud even if no one believes me.

 

[just1morething]

The reason I am leaving is because I don't have any options left. I can't bullshit my way out of this mess.

It's a shit situation. Death is so damn final and unknown and suffering is a lousy existence. I get some relief, but not enough. I don't know exactly what affliction you have but I'm sure it's tough to endure. Of course I hope there is some relief in your future other than death.

 

[Contrast]

Suicide is better then psychological resilience. It creates a vicious cycle that it claims to stop.

 

[Contrast]

It's so stupid some people stay alive just to suffer miserably without hope. My new health problems do not have hope.

 

[valeri]

It's so stupid some people stay alive just to suffer miserably without hope. My new health problems do not have hope.

Survival instinct is a bastard...

 

[Daniel Lion]

It's so stupid some people stay alive just to suffer miserably without hope. My new health problems do not have hope.

I am sorry to hear that sir Contrast.

Suffering sucks... everyday is a challenge.

I do hope your health problems experience a fluke, a random act of chaos for the better.
Take care, from another sufferer on the otherside of the globe.

Sincerely, Daniel